for that eighth car, with seven buyers, you would run the price of all eight down. So what I am trying to say is that the extra 5 percent of imports can break the back of anything under certain conditions.

In that connection, I ran across the fact recently that some folks in some areas of the country are going to South America and Central America, going into the cattle business there. So I checked to see how they were going and this is what we are doing as a Nation.

FOREIGN ASSISTANCE UNDER AID PROGRAM

Under the Foreign Assistance Act of 1961, if the members of this subcommittee, using them as an example, wished to do so, we could get approval to go to South America or Central America, to go in the cattle business. And the Agency for International Development would pay 50 percent of the cost of our trip down there just to look the situation over.

Now, if we didn't go in business, we never would have to repay that. If we went in business, our Government would make loans to the five of us to go down there and go in the cattle business through the AID program, the World Bank, the International Finance Corporation, the Inter-American Development Bank, or the Export-Import Bank.

Then, after we got down there, if we picked a country that had some of this foreign currency on deposit, we could get a local loan.

Then when we went in the cattle business on a big scale, we could send our production back in here for sale on the domestic marketU.S. financed, U.S. promoted, and no restrictions on sending it back. And then the AID program would guarantee against political risks if somebody else wanted to take over the Government, and would guarantee against some business risks.

Is the Department familiar with that and have we made any protest against it? Do you have any knowledge of how many such loans may have been made, not just in cattle, but in connection with all agricultural commodities of which we have a surplus and where we have difficulty?

Secretary FREEMAN. I am not familiar with the cattle example, which the chairman cites.

INVESTIGATION OF MEAT IMPORTS

Mr. WHITTEN. I am quoting from reports that I had orally, plus newspaper stories. May I say at this point, this committee some weeks ago asked our committee investigators to develop and report to us (1) the volume of U.S. imports of livestock, meat, and meat products from Canada, and Australia, New Zealand, Argentina, Brazil, and other major producing countries for the past 10 years; (2) programs and policies of Federal agencies governing imports of livestock, meat, and meat products from abroad, including changes made during this 10-year period; (3) examples of the use of section 22 of the Agricultural Adjustment Act to control such imports or lack of use of such authority; (4) policies and programs of the Federal Government and

agencies such as International Bank involving the furnishing of technical and financial assistance to organizations or individuals in foreign countries for production of livestock, meat, and meat products; (5) names of U.S. citizens or organizations which have gone into livestock production in foreign countries during this period including information on location volume and whether or not U.S. Government loans were involved; (6) the legislative authority for U.S. agencies to engage in such programs and the amount of Federal funds and number of employees engaged in such programs; (7) the U.S. price levels at the farm, wholesale, and retail level of such products during the period and effect of price changes on U.S. livestock producers; (8) the effect of such imports on the use of section 32 funds and on the various farm programs of the United States affecting grain production and marketing.

Now, if they are selling cattle in the United States from these countries, quite definitely somebody here is not going to be using American feed to feed his livestock which is displaced. He can't do it long, to say the least. We have asked for this information in order to follow it up.

AID PAMPHLET FOR U.S. BUSINESSMEN

Our Government just to make it easy for our folks to go abroad and ruin us by sending this stuff back, has published a real nice looking pamphlet here and it is headed "U.S. Government Memorandum to Businessmen From State Department, Agency for International Development, Subject: Aid to Business Overseas Investment."

Now, do you have membership on any board or any policymaking group on this matter? Or is Agriculture ignored in connection with this?

As the chair

Secretary FREEMAN. This pamphlet, I have not seen. man is well aware, of course, there is a widespread AID program and our efforts in it have been, where agriculture is concerned, to contribute to the national policies and to seek to influence and shape those policies so that the interests of American agriculture will be protected and furthered accordingly.

I might say, Mr. Chairman, that our exports, our agricultural exports have increased very, very rapidly, and much more percentagewise, for example, than the concessional exports under the food-forpeace program. I think that in the overall, where the AID programs have been successful, I might cite Japan as the outstanding example. The result has been a very significant increase in exports of our own agriculture commodities.

Japan today is the No. 1 agricultural importer from the United States. It was one of these countries that we gave very significant aid to during a period when they were having very, very severe difficulties.

The detailed administration of this program is something I am not familiar with.

Mr. WHITTEN. I realize that you are not familiar with this. Neither was I familiar with it. I knew, as I said, from past experience, and investigations of this committee, that we were busy furnishing tech

E

nicians to put ourselves out of business in areas where we were in trouble ourselves.

But now, furnishing technical help is one thing, though I opposed most of that, and have been voting against it for a long, long time. But these are American people with money that we invite to go abroad and go in business and guarantee them against losses over there, when here at home, they would have to take their own risk.

Mr. Secretary, do you know of any way that American agriculture can live with our Government sending folks abroad to go in business to send things back here and guarantee them against risk abroad, but let domestic producers run all the risk here?

Secretary FREEMAN. I would answer that

Mr. HORAN. I might say these are ones that probably wouldn't go in business at home in this country.

Secretary FREEMAN. Mr. Chairman, I am not prepared to cite specific figures, but in a number of instances, and perhaps I speak a bit selfishly, as one whose responsibilities run to agriculture, that the improvements of the economies in countries which hitherto have been unable to import any American agriculture commodities is almost immediately followed by significant increases in our markets in those countries.

And if we are able to help their economies and to create markets in the process for American agriculture exports, as Secretary of Agriculture, I am actively trying to further our exports and to sweeten our own agriculture economy and to give greater markets to our farm producers.

I think a very strong case can be made in many, many countries that this is what has resulted.

Our exports have climbed very sharply; today agriculture is one of our main dollar earners, and although there are some subnormal factors in this year's trade, it will run close to $6 billion a year, a very significant increase, and has been climbing steadily.

A part of this climb has been in countries whose economies had been stimulated and perhaps in part by programs that have stimulated investments so that they will be able to afford in turn to purchase American agriculture commodities.

U.S. EXPORTS TO NEW ZEALAND AND AUSTRALIA

Mr. WHITTEN. We have two examples here, New Zealand and Australia, that are exporting all this beef to us. What has been the record on our export of agriculture commodities to Australia and New Zealand?

Secretary FREEMAN. I know roughly some, but these are not AID countries. These, Mr. Chairman, as you know

Mr. WHITTEN. I don't know whether they qualify for this. There may be some restrictions as to what countries. I guess they would not be classified as underdeveloped, so they probably would be excluded. Secretary FREEMAN. I think so.

Mr. WHITTEN. We might have in the record what the facts are with regard to our export of agriculture commodities to these countries which you list as being exporters of livestock to the United States.

(The information referred to follows:)

Exports under Public Law 480 of agricultural commodities by type of program to selected countries which are principal exporters of meat to the United States, fiscal years 1956-57-1962-63