The subcommittee further recommends that the appraisal be made in two steps. First, a "feasibility" study should be conducted to get a clear cut picture of the problem and the kinds of results which are likely to be achieved. Second, determine from the feasibility study the course to follow before committing substantial funds to a full scale study. It is possible that the feasibility study may be sufficient for current purposes.

It is further recommended that funds to support the necessary study be obtained, by grant, from the Public Health Division of the Department of Health, Education and Welfare or the Bureau of Public Roads of the Department of Commerce, individually or jointly, and that the study be made under the direction of the Office of the President or the Presidents Committee for Traffic Safety to avoid any undue feeling on the part of affected Agencies.

Senator RIBICOFF. I think my decision to have you talk off the cuff was. a. wise one, because I think you have made some very, very pertinent comments.

I would ask that the comments of Mr. Moynihan be typed up today, if possible, and be sent over to the Department of Commerce. I am just curious about what reaction they may have.

You make a lot of sense in almost everything you do, Mr. Moynihan, in my experience with you. I appreciate your coming here. I have the feeling as the years go by that if you are still in Government or are around I will be calling on you from time to time, because I think you have a lot to add.

It is my belief, as I tried to say to Secretary Celebrezze, that unless enough of us really care about this, enough of us want to do something about it, enough of us from the general public, the automobile manufacturers, and the congressional branch of the Government, the executive branch of the Government, we are not going to accomplish very much. However, I do have the feeling that if we are interested enough we may be able to save a few lives, and I think this is worth trying for. Thank you very much for coming.

Mr. MOYNIHAN. Thank you for the privilege.

Senator RIBICOFF. Our next witness will be Mr. Webb.

Mr. Webb, I welcome you here. You are another one of our public servants for whom I have the highest respect from every contact I have ever had with you in any capacity. I know that you are thoughtful and you do a good job.

Now, instead of keeping you here for a long period of time, let us take your formal statement and consider it as read.

One of the reasons you are here is because you do have a responsibility which you exercise for safety in a large segment of automobiles, trucks, and buses in the field of interstate commerce. Now, what I would like to know is, what is your general authority and what do you do for safety features in trucks and buses in interstate commerce, and are there any lessons that your agency has learned from this regulatory process that could be used to advantage with the private automobile. Your statement will go in the record as if you had read it. We will give you an opportunity to correct the record. Just let me have your thinking generally.

STATEMENT OF CHARLES A. WEBB, CHAIRMAN, INTERSTATE COMMERCE COMMISSION; ACCOMPANIED BY HERBERT QUALLS, DIRECTOR, BUREAU OF MOTOR CARRIERS; AND E. G. COX, CHIEF, SECTION OF MOTOR CARRIER SAFETY

(The prepared statement of Mr. Webb follows:)

EXHIBIT 27

Statement PREPARED BY CHARLES A. WEBB, CHAIRMAN, INTERSTATE Commerce COMMISSION

Mr. Chairman, Members of the Subcommittee:

My name is Charles A. Webb. I am the Chairman of the Interstate Commerce Commission and have served in that capacity since January 1, 1965.

I appreciate this opportunity to discuss the responsibilities and activities of the Commission with respect to motor carrier safety. We share the concern expressed by you, Mr. Chairman, in your speech of February 18, 1965, on the Senate Floor regarding the increasing toll of fatalities and serious injuries on the nation's highways. We are aware of your efforts, as the Governor of Connecticut and later as the Secretary of Health, Education and Welfare, to halt this carnage. We are extremely conscious of our own responsibility with respect to one important phase of the problem.

The authority of the Interstate Commerce Commission in the field of highway safety stems from two statutes. Part II of the Interstate Commerce Act authorizes the Commission to issue rules and regulations governing the qualifications and maximum hours of service of employees, and safety of operation and equipment, of motor carriers of passengers and property engaged in interstate or foreign commerce.

Title 18 of the United States Code, sections 831-835, entitled "Explosives

and Other Dangerous Articles", directs the Commission to formulate regulations for the safe transportation of such articles within the United States. The Commission's regulations apply to surface carriers of passengers and property and to shippers of explosives and other dangerous articles via land or water carriers engaged in interstate or foreign commerce.

The Commission's safety jurisdiction extends to all motor carriers engaged in interstate or foreign commerce, including those whose operations are specifically exempted from economic regulation. More than 18,000 motor carriers hold certificates or permits issued by the Commission. These authorized carriers operate an estimated 925,000 vehicles. We can identify about 95,000 private carriers and exempt for-hire carriers. We estimate that at least 140,000 carriers are subject to our safety jurisdiction and that they operate approximately 2,000,000

commercial vehicles.

We do not have accurate information as to the number of motor carriers

engaged in the interstate transportation of explosives and other dangerous articles. Most common carriers of general commodities transport some commodities classified as dangerous. Many carriers are specially authorized to transport explosives or other hazardous commodities. We estimate that about 6, 000 authorized carriers transport dangerous commodities in significant amounts.

Based on a random sample of known private carriers, we estimate that approximately 5,000 transport dangerous commodities in significant quantity. Thus,

we estimate that about 11,000 motor carriers, common, contract, and private, transport dangerous commodities on public highways. A rulemaking proceeding is now before the Commission, hearings having been concluded on March 10, 1965, to require private carriers of dangerous commodities to report that fact to the Commission each year.

The Commission has a motor carrier safety staff which, considering the number of motor carriers subject to our regulations, is very small. We have 99 field staff safety inspectors who devote full time to this work. We have 126 field district supervisors who devote a part of their time to safety matters. Nevertheless, with the cooperation of State and local agencies of government, we conduct a vigorous program of enforcement. With the cooperation and assistance of industry groups, we have managed to keep our regulations abreast of technological developments and have contributed to the promotion of highway safety through

education.

About ten years ago, the Commission initiated a planned program for inspection of vehicles on the highways. Vehicles are removed immediately from service when they are found to be imminently hazardous to operate. We make approximately 50,000 vehicle inspections each year. About 2, 200 of these are buses and the remainder are trucks. Last year more than 11,000 of these vehicles were ordered out of service and were not permitted to travel beyond the point of inspection until repairs were made. This type of inspection is in addition to

examination of carriers' records and practices at their headquarters offices and

terminals.