They went over the postwar plan and they had observations and recommendations to make as a result of which there were a few changes in the number of ships in the different categories.

The CHAIRMAN. How long have you been working on this plan, approximately?

I suppose it began before the war was over?

Admiral DENFELD. I think it did.

Admiral HopwOOD. About a year and a half.

The CHAIRMAN. I knew it was a long period of time. It is very reasonable to believe that it has been thoroughly studied. Admiral DENFELD. Yes, sir; no question about that.

Senator TOBEY. Some 4 or 5 months ago, I think it was time goes so quickly-Admiral King and the Secretary and the staff officers had a meeting here and they had a series of graphs and charts which were very illuminating and showed the picture more graphically than could a written statement.

I wonder if those have been reduced to facsimiles which we might have before us in studying the contemplated legislation. (Discussion off the record.)

Senator SALTONSTALL. I would like to ask a question.

Has there been a study prepared on costs in connection with these ships and bases and personnel?

Admiral DENFELD. Yes, sir.

Senator SALTONSTALL. So that ultimately we will get those costs as well?

Admiral DENFELD. Yes, sir. They have been worked out.

The CHAIRMAN. Of course, a discussion about the size of the personnel will raise the question of costs, too.

Admiral DENFELD. As I remember it, they figured the total cost of this postwar Navy will be between 3 and 4 billion dollars a year. Admiral HopwOOD. About 31⁄2 billion.

The CHAIRMAN. Gentlemen, we will adjourn until tomorrow morning at 10:30, when we will go into the details of the bill.

Admiral DENFELD. We will go into it section by section, sir.
The CHAIRMAN. The committee is adjourned.

(Whereupon, at 12 noon, the committee adjourned until 10:30 a. m., Friday, December 14, 1945.)

AUTHORIZING PERMANENT OFFICER AND ENLISTED STRENGTH OF THE UNITED STATES NAVY AND THE UNITED STATES MARINE CORPS.

FRIDAY, DECEMBER 14, 1945

UNITED STATES SENATE,
COMMITTEE ON NAVAL AFFAIRS,

Washington, D. C.

The committee met, pursuant to call, at 10:30 a. m., in room 212, Senate Office Building, Senator David I. Walsh (chairman) presiding. Present: Senators Walsh (chairman), Robertson, and Saltonstall. The CHAIRMAN. Will you come forward, Admiral.

STATEMENT OF VICE ADM. LOUIS E. DENFELD Resumed

The CHAIRMAN. I want to ask your pardon, Admiral, for keeping you waiting, but they were pressing for approval of those projects. What point had we reached?

Admiral DENFELD. We were going, section by section, through the bill itself.

I might say, Senator Walsh, as you know, while the Bureau of the Budget has not cleared this legislation, the President has told us to go ahead with it. I will go ahead with the section by section part. The CHAIRMAN. Did the House make any changes in the original draft?

Admiral DENFELD. No, sir. As I remember it, the only change was in the preamble. They wrote a little more definite preamble to the bill itself to make sure the Naval Reserve officers would be given fair treatment.

Senator SALTONSTALL. Mr. Chairman, I happened to see the Pittsburgh papers last night, and there are some very derogatory statements contained therein about the Navy, in relation to the situation in San Francisco, about turning men into the streets with no place to sleep and eat, and other conditions concerning men being discharged and the attitude of the Navy toward dischargees. It was a very derogatory article that appeared in the Pittsburgh press of last night, and I would like to call that to your attention.

Admiral DENFELD. Last night?

Senator SALTONSTALL. Yes, sir.

Admiral DENFELD. I cannot believe there is any truth in that. Senator SALTONSTALL. It was in relation to conditions in San Francisco right now, and I think it is worthy of your investigation. Admiral DENFELD. All people discharged are being sent to their home separation centers.

The CHAIRMAN. Has there not been some congestion there due to the fact that they cannot get trains?

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Admiral DENFELD. We take care of them until they do get the train.

The CHAIRMAN. And you have plenty of barracks?

Admiral DENFELD. We have plenty of facilities in staging centers to take care of them until they do go. I cannot believe there is any truth in that article, but I will look it up.

The CHAIRMAN. Off the record.

(Discussion off the record.)

The CHAIRMAN. Proceed, Admiral.

Admiral DENFELD. Section 1: States the policy of the Congress, which also expresses, wholeheartedly my own views, that in all matters relating to commissioned officers in the Regular Navy there shall be no discrimination whatsoever against any officer regardless of the source from which they received their appointments in the Regular Navy; and, among other things, that commissioned officers in the Regular Navy, regardless of source of appointment, shall receive equal treatment with respect to opportunities for (1) promotion or advancement to all grades in the Navy, (2) holding any positions or assignments in the Navy including proportionate representation on selection boards, and (3) attending the Naval War College, postgraduate schools or other schools, or otherwise receiving advanced or technical training. Section 2 (a): Provides for a permanent authorized enlisted strength of the active list of the Regular Navy of 500,000 men.

Present law, as indicated earlier, and contained in the act approved April 22, 1941 (Public Law 39, 77th Cong.), provides a permanent authorized enlisted strength of 232,000, which may be further increased by the President only in time of emergency to 500,000 men.

It is the present plan in maintaining an active fleet of 1,672 ships, that such ships would be manned, except in the case of submarines and small craft where safety dictates the necessity of a larger percentage, at 70 percent of wartime complement. Similarly, the reserve fleet consisting of 2,313 ships, would be manned at (1) 20 percent of wartime complement if employed in shipboard training, that is, for the training of midshipmen, students in NROTC and other reservists; (2) 30 percent of wartime complement if employed in operational training and for experiment and development. By operational training is meant refresher training conducted for personnel of the active fleet.

The inactive fleet, consisting of 2,099 ships, would be maintained with only sufficient personnel necessary for preservation.

I have a number of tables, Senator Walsh, and would like to put all of those in the record.

The CHAIRMAN. They may go in the record.

(Tables 1 to 5, inclusive, submitted by Admiral Denfeld, are as follows:)