NAVAL RADIO STATION, CLAM LAGOON, ADAK,

ALASKA

Admiral CHEW. The first project is at the Naval Radio Station, Clam Lagoon, Adak, Alaska, for new radio receiver facilities at the estimated cost of $670,000.

Senator STENNIS. That is a part of what system now, Admiral Chew?

Admiral CHEW. This is for the extension of a receiver building and antennas that we have there right at the present time.

Senator STENNIS. I know. What is that a part of? Your worldwide communications system?

Admiral CHEW. It is a part of our communications to the fleet, as a naval requirement, sir.

Senator STENNIS. All right. Next item.

Senator ENGLE. May I ask a question on that?

Senator STENNIS. Yes.

Senator ENGLE. Not with reference to this particular matter, but I have two points:

No. 1, what effort is made by the Navy to coordinate their communication network with that of the other services?

The Army was in here yesterday, and they had one with respect from here to the moon, and I saw a demonstration one day at the Pentagon by the Air Force that astonished me.

Does each one of the services maintain its own communications system?

Admiral CHEW. I think that can best be answered this way, Senator Engle: These facilities, generally speaking, are naval facilities for servicing the fleet and its associated elements.

In the point-to-point or worldwide system they have been thoroughly coordinated at the DOD level, with the Army and the Air Force, so that these are compatible communications.

There is not duplication in that field, sir.

Senator ENGLE. Now, the second question.

Admiral CHEW. Yes, sir.

Senator ENGLE. Are these communication facilities hardened to any degree? For instance, I am advised that a system is set up to communicate with undersea craft. Now, those could be knocked flatter than a flitter, and our communications with the fleet overseas, and especially the underwater fleet, would be out of operation. Is there any effort to harden them?

Admiral CHEW. There is no hardening of the communication facilities, but there are more than one-in other words, there would be two stations that would take care of an area, so that you would have reliability in case one station is knocked out, sir.

I think we are getting close to the classified area, sir.

Admiral WILSON. These things are parallel so that no one--the destruction of any one would not disrupt the system.

Senator ENGLE. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Senator STENNIS. Yes, sir; thank you. Senator Engle, you interrupt whenever you wish now on any project.

Senator ENGLE. I wanted to return at some appropriate moment to one item I wanted to ask about that the Secretary was on.

Senator STENNIS. All right. As soon as we finish this, we will

return.

NAVAL RADIO STATION, ANNAPOLIS, MD.

Admiral CHEW. The second is page 54, sir-two line items at the Naval Radio Station, Annapolis, for a total of $795,000.

Senator STENNIS. Excuse me a minute. It is mighty hard for us to have any kind of informed opinion about any particular item here. May we ask, How will your answers apply to all of these installations that you have just given to Senator Engle? Do you find them all necessary? And, according to your approach, you could not get this service anywhere else? Is it a necessary part of your naval communications?

Admiral CHEW. That is correct, Senator. They fall generally into two or three categories.

Senator STENNIS. Yes.

Admiral CHEW. One is to provide more reliable communications to our fleet. A second category is to improve certain security aspects and the collection of information. They all meet naval requirements and, as I stated to Senator Engle, they are coordinated on point-topoint aspects so there is no duplication of the other service facilities. Senator STENNIS. Take, for instance, here an antenna, $645,000, on the next page, and you have "Antenna," $390,000.

Well, Senator Engle may have an idea about what is a reasonable cost, but I certainly do not, and I doubt that he has had a chance to know.

Does that mean the construction of the setup and also the equipment or is that just the equipment?

Admiral CHEW. This is for the entire construction, sir. Perhaps Admiral Peltier would like to talk to it.

Senator STENNIS. Admiral?

Admiral PELTIER. It is not the black boxes, Mr. Chairman. This is what we call a Wullenweber system, composed of poles, wires, and grounding system, and, if required, a building and its utilities. Senator STENNIS. All right.

NAVAL RADIO STATION, CHELTENHAM, MD.

Admiral CHEW. The next project is at the Naval Radio Station, Cheltenham, Md., for construction of antennas at the estimated cost of $396,000. As the Annapolis station provides the transmitting facilities, this activity provides the receiver facilities for the Naval Čommunication Station, Washington, D.C. This project will provide for three high-gain directional receiving antennas and four ship-to-shore sector sleeve antennas necessary for improved communication in modern fleet operations. High-speed, high-volume, reliable, and secure communication between ships at sea in the Atlantic Ocean area and the Mediterranean Sea and shore-based commands are a prerequisite to the success of naval operations in this strategic area.

Senator STENNIS. Pages 54 and 55 are about the same, then, except the difference in costs? Do you want to say something about 56 especially, fleet broadcast facilities? What is that $2.5 million?

54781-60-20

NAVAL RADIO STATION, DIXON, CALIF.

Admiral CHEW. This is fleet broadcast facilities at an estimated cost of $2,974,000. The Dixon station is a transmitter component of the San Francisco Naval Communication Station, that is, for fleet broadcasts, and the proposed facilities include an addition to the existing transmitter building; two 650-foot-high vertical antennas and associated transmission lines.

The low-frequency components of the fleet broadcast will be installed at Dixon to replace the five 540-foot-high towers-correction there they are slightly shorter, about 450-foot towers, at Mare Island, which must be removed because of their hazard to avigation at the present time; also to life and property, I think Admiral Wilson has seen them-and they are in an advanced state of deterioration. They are our primary towers there now, and this is a relocation on Government land of the same facilities.

Senator STENNIS. When were they built?

Admiral CHEW. The towers at Mare Island were built

Senator STENNIS. Well, I just asked you because you say they have deteriorated to such an extent that replacement is urgently required; personnel can no longer climb the towers.

Admiral PELTIER. They are 40 years old.

Senator STENNIS. I did not think anything used 40 years ago could be used now.

Admiral WILSON. A considerable element of modernization has been done in all of these.

Senator STENNIS. All right. That is $212 million.

NAVAL RADIO STATION, SKAGGS ISLAND, CALIF.

Now, the next item is a million and a half dollars, in round numbers, radio direction finder facilities.

Admiral CHEW. There are in this program, Mr. Chairman, three of these stations. This one is a radio direction finder at Skaggs Island.

NAVAL RADIO STATION, WAHIAWA, OAHU, HAWAII

The next project is for construction of antennas at the Naval Radio Station, Wahiawa, Oahu, Hawaii, at the estimated cost of $357,000. This is the receiver activity for the Naval Communication Station at Pearl Harbor. The project is for relocation and rebuilding of existing deteriorated and obsolete antennas and the construction of additional antennas needed for the operation of special radio equipment. The new weapons systems employed by units of the fleet in ASW and other operations, require this improvement for command and control of the Pacific Fleets. Failure to provide this facility will prevent utilization of the shipborne counterparts of this essential communication capability, inasmuch as many units of the fleets are equipped with the special radio facilities designed for ship-toshore employment of this special system.

NAVAL SECURITY GROUP ACTIVITY, WINTER HARBOR,

MAINE

The seventh project is at the Naval Security Group activity, Winter Harbor, Maine, for construction of a radio direction finder facility at the estimated cost of $2,279,000. The mission of this station is to perform radio receiver and security group functions. Accurate radio direction finder bearings are required from this area for more accurate North Atlantic fixes in support of the ASW program and Naval Security Group functions. This is another Wullenweber installation similar to that proposed for the Naval Radio Station at Skaggs Island, Calif. This specially designed instrument satisfies the requirement by its capability of rapid control techniques and of providing more accurate and longer range bearings than existing facilities.

There are similar facilities in the classified section that I will mention later, so there is a total of four. These are in conjunction with our increased ASW effort.

Senator STENNIS. Are they such facilities that you could have considered them as being all in one package?

Admiral CHEW. No, sir, they have to be located in different areas. Senator STENNIS. Different places. All right.

Admiral CHEW. Yes, sir.

Senator STENNIS. Senator Engle, do you have any knowledge of these, anything special you want to ask?

Senator ENGLE. No, I do not.

Senator STENNIS. Let us return to Senator Engle's items then. Senator Engle will now proceed.

Senator ENGLE. I just wanted to ask one question. It related to the item in the House bill that was by amendment, increasing the Naval Shipyard at Charleston, S.C., maintenance facility, $17,355,000. That was raised by the House $15 million.

Did you folks approve that?

Admiral CHEW. Senator, that is for a drydock of $15 million for the POLARIS submarines. We have a need for that, although it is not programed, nor is it funded for fiscal 1961. It will be funded in 1962.

Senator ENGLE. I read the House report, and here is what they said:

Excellent reports have been received from the Navy on the progress of the POLARIS weapons system.

Let me say parenthetically I have supported the POLARIS, and still do, and I think it is an excellent weapons system.

But they go on to say:

It is not unrealistic to expect that the POLARIS submarine will be fully operational later in this calendar year. In anticipation of the need for adequate support to service the components of a modern submarine, and the long time required in design and construction, the committee has included authorization in the bill for building a drydock naval shipyard at Charleston in the amount of $15 million. This will round out the support facilities for the POLARIS submarine at the first home port, Charleston.

If it is not classified information, would you tell me what that port will then be programed to handle in the way of POLARIS submarines, how many? I emphasize, if that is not classified information.

Admiral CHEW. It will be ready at that time to handle the presently programed submarines, sir, and this will be a repair facility to take care of those submarines that we now envisage.

Senator ENGLE. Well now, as I understand it, that has been announced to the public. How many is that?

Admiral CHEW. This will be

Admiral WILSON. The whole Charleston complex is predicated on two squadrons, actually.

Senator ENGLE. Two squadrons is how many?

Admiral WILSON. That would be 18.

Senator ENGLE. In other words, that would take care of, as I understood it, they added some, and that gets the POLARIS submarine up to about 20, it seemed to me.

Admiral WILSON. This is why we would like to have this authorization in this bill for this drydock, because under the original program, this was all phased in, of course, as we saw that we would need it, and we would have undoubtedly come in in the fiscal year of 1962 program for this under the original program, both authorization and funding.

By getting the authorization now it gives us a little bit of flexibility so that if there are adjustments or a speedup in the POLARIS program-this would give us a little bit of flexibility. We would certainly be in favor of this being authorized at this time.

Senator ENGLE. Well, there are two basic questions, and let me say, if this takes care of current needs of submarines presently programed, and either funded or in process of being funded, I would not object to it.

But what I want to find out is how far the Navy is going with the POLARIS until such time as the POLARIS is a proven weapon system.

Now, I have observed, Mr. Chairman, that there are two ideas abroad which, in my opinion, are erroneous. One is that the POLARIS is a proven weapons system and, No. 2, that it is relatively invulnerable.

Now, these questions may not be appropriate to you gentlemen at this level, but I want to ask you this question, if you can answer it: Does the Navy now believe that the POLARIS submarine is a proven weapons system?

Admiral WILSON. Yes, sir, we do.

Senator ENGLE. Have you ever fired one from under water? Admiral WILSON. They have been fired from under water, yes. Senator ENGLE. Yes, but they have not been fired from a submarine, have they?

Admiral WILSON. The test vehicle has, which is of the same dimensions as

Senator ENGLE. I understand that, but I am talking about a submarine, and I understand there are very grave technical problems yet to be solved.

Admiral Wilson. A test vehicle has been fired from a submarine. Senator ENGLE. On the surface?

Admiral WILSON. No, sir; submerged.

Senator ENGLE. Could you hit the broad side of a continent with it?