STATEMENT OF DR. E. O. LITTLE, DISTRICT MEDICAL OFFICER, DISTRICT NO. 7, CINCINNATI, OHIO. (The witness was duly sworn by the chairman.) The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Dallinger, Dr. Little is connected with the Cincinnati office; do you want to examine him? Mr. DALLINGER. What is your connection with the Cincinnati office? Dr. LITTLE. I am district medical officer, District No. 7, detailed from the Public Health Service. Mr. DALLINGER. How long have you been in the Cincinnati office? Dr. LITTLE. Since November 1, 1919. Mr. DALLINGER. Since you have been there have you had enough doctors to conduct the examinations without causing the applicants to wait unduly? Dr. LITTLE. I have. Mr. DALLINGER. What on the average would be the time that an applicant for training at the Cincinnati office would have to wait for his examination? Dr. LITTLE. I should say on the average not over from one to three hours, when they were required to wait, occasionally. Mr. DALLINGER. That condition of affairs has prevailed since you have been in Cincinnati? Dr. LITTLE. Yes, sir. Mr. DALLINGER. Where is your office located in Cincinnati? Dr. LITTLE. You mean the address? Mr. DALLINGER. Yes, sir; whereabouts is the office? Dr. LITTLE. In the Denton Building, corner of Race and Seventh Streets. Mr. DALLINGER. Does the Public Health Bureau of the Treasury have an office in the same building? Dr. LITTLE. They do not. The district office of the Public Health Service is on Fourth Street, practically at the corner of Fourth and Race Streets, three blocks away. Mr. DALLINGER. Has the War Risk Insurance Bureau an office in Cincinnati? Dr. LITTLE. Not to my knowledge. I think the War Risk Insurance Bureau has a representative in that section, but not especially assigned to Cincinnati. Mr. DALLINGER. Do you know where his headquarters are? Dr. LITTLE. I do not. Mr. DALLINGER. You think that it would be an advantage to have the three departments in the same building like they are in New York and Philadelphia? Dr. LITTLE. I think undoubtedly there would be a good deal of advantage in having the office of the district supervisor of the Public Health Service and Federal board and the Red Cross in the same building. Mr. DALLINGER. Has any recommendation been made to that effect by anyone in Cincinnati? Dr. LITTLE. I can not say positively, but I think such a recommendation has been made. In fact, I know that there have been sev eral conferences between the three organizations, beginning about December, but at no time have they been able to find sufficient space to accommodate the three organizations in one building. Mr. DALLINGER. Has the vocational board sufficient space, in your opinion? Dr. LITTLE. They have, since the middle of February. Mr. DALLINGER. What was the situation previous to the middle of January? Dr. LITTLE. We were greatly overcrowded. Mr. DALLINGER. As a result of that overcrowding was there some delay in acting on cases? Dr. LITTLE. Well, I should say possibly some delay was caused by that overcrowded condition. Mr. DALLINGER. How many medical officers are there in Cincinnati working for the Federal board? Dr. LITTLE. I have six in Cincinnati and two outside of Cincinnati. Mr. DALLINGER. Where are they located? Dr. LITTLE. One in Cleveland and one in Indianapolis, in the branch offices. Mr. DALLINGER. Has there been any complaint from those men that they did not have assistance; have they asked for additional help? Dr. LITTLE. No; they have not. Mr. DALLINGER. They have been able to take care of the boys they have examined without any undue delay? Dr. LITTLE. Yes, sir. Mr. DALLINGER. Have you heard of any complaints from any of the soldiers in the Cincinnati district of their treatment by employees of the vocational board? Dr. LITTLE. I have not. Mr. DALLINGER. Has there been any complaint in the way of letters from soldiers in leading newspapers there; have you seen anything of that kind? Dr. LITTLE. No, sir. Mr. DALLINGER. Do you know whether or not there has been any delay in acting on cases after the application has gone in and the boy has been examined? Dr. LITTLE. Not more than I believe would be necessary from the volume of work and the size of the staff. I think that the cases are acted upon in a reasonable length of time. Mr. DALLINCER. What would you call a reasonable length of time from the time the boy first makes his application? Dr. LITTLE. Well, if the items in the case are complete, I should say within 10 days or 2 weeks. Mr. DALLINGER. Your office has authority now to act in these cases without sending them to Washington? Dr. LITTLE. Yes, sir. We have an appeal board and in a case where there is disagreement the case may be placed before this board. of appeals which takes action. Mr. DALLINGER. But, if the report of the medical staff is favorable, the boy's papers are properly filled out, and the district vocational officer there and his subordinates pass favorably upon the case, it does not have to come to Washington? Dr. LITTLE. It does not. Mr. DALLINGER. You can put the boy right into training? Mr. DALLINGER. You said that in 10 days to 2 weeks, do you mean that on an average or in some cases you are able to put the boy in sooner? Dr. LITTLE. In a great many cases he may be placed in training the same day. Mr. DALLINGER. Have you known of such cases? Dr. LITTLE. Yes, sir. Mr. DALLINGER. That is, the man would come in in the morning and make his application? Dr. LITTLE. Yes, sir. Mr. DALLINGER. For the first time? Dr. LITTLE. Yes, sir. Mr. DALLINGER. And where it was a perfectly obvious case and you had no difficulty in determining that he was entitled to compensation on account of his injury, you have put the case through in one day? Dr. LITTLE. Yes, sir. Mr. DALLINGER. And the boy has actually been placed in one day? Dr. LITTLE. I have one case in mind where the man's papers were completed in less than two hours. In all cases where a man reports directly to the office, unless there is something exceptionally wrong he receives an answer before he leaves the office. Mr. DALLINGER. I know that this is not in your line, being a representative from the Cincinnati office, and if you do not feel like answering from your knowledge of course you are at liberty to say so. Dr. LITTLE. All right. Mr. DALLINGER. I want to ask you if on the whole you think that the cases of disabled soldiers are being handled and the boys put in training with satisfaction to the boys themselves and to the community, so far as the Cincinnati office is concerned? Dr. LITTLE. I think they are. I have heard of no complaints which I believed were just. Mr. DALLINGER. You think that they have a sufficient staff of advisers and trainers, men in charge of the training department? Dr. LITTLE. Well, I believe that the staff is insufficient. Mr. DALLINGER. You think perhaps that there would be still less delay if there were more men? Dr. LITTLE. Yes, sir; more men. Of course, this is not a thing that I can speak upon, because it is out of my line. I know it is true that it is difficult for them to secure men with experience along industrial lines to conduct the work pertaining to those fields. Mr. DALLINGER. Is that due to the fact of the salary limitation? Dr. LITTLE. It is undoubtedly due to the salary. Mr. DALLINGER. What does your appeal board consist of? Dr. LITTLE. The appeal board consists of the district vocational officer, the district medical officer, and the representative from the central office who is stationed in the district office. Mr. DALLINGER. He is not a medical man, I suppose? Dr. LITTLE. No. The district medical officer is the only medical representative on the board. Mr. DALLINGER. From your experience, would you say that there was any danger of the two laymen overriding the opinion of the medical officer? Dr. LITTLE. No, sir. Mr. DALLINGER. On the question of eligibility? Dr. LITTLE. No, sir. Mr. DALLINGER. What has been your experience with regard to the appeal board; you have been a member? Dr. LITTLE. Yes, sir; I have been a member of the appeal board. I think never in any case has my medical opinion been overridden by the laymen. Mr. DALLINGER. Do you see any objection to having the man who has refused the boy training in the first instance, and he has appealed, sit on the appeal board? I take it the district vocational officer is the man who, in the last instance, reviews the boy's training and passes upon the papers; there is an appeal made, as I understand, and he sits upon the appeal board, does he not? Dr. LITTLE. The district vocational officer? Mr. DALLINGER. Yes, sir. Dr. LITTLE. I see the point. Mr. DALLINGER. Suppose you have examined the boy a second time and have changed your mind, or something has developed in the boy's condition between the time of the first examination and the second, and you were satisfied that he was eligible, whether or not in such a case you have found the district vocational officer opinionated in any way and insisting upon his former decision, or whether he is open to conviction and willing to give the boy a fair determination upon the appeal? Dr. LITTLE. There has been no difficulty of that sort in our office. The fact, as I say, is that the ruling of the medical officer is usually allowed to stand. Mr. DALLINGER. Have you heard of any complaint from the boys in regard to their training after put in training or whether they have been satisfied? Dr. LITTLE. I have heard no complaint with regard to training in general. The only complaint I have heard is where a man has tried out some particular line and returned to the office and says he is unable to carry on that line or does not take to the work and wishes to be entered in some other line of training. Mr. DALLINGER. Has the district vocational officer always been willing to give the boy another chance? Dr. LITTLE. There is always a conference held, and the man is given another trial. As many as four or five attempts have been made to satisfy the man. Mr. DALLINGER. On the whole, you think the work of the Vocational Board has been well conducted, without any undue delay, in Cincinnati? Dr. LITTLE. Yes, sir. Mr. DALLINGER. I think that is all. The CHAIRMAN. How is the morale of the Cincinnati office? Dr. LITTLE. The morale is splendid. The CHAIRMAN. Are you sufficiently well acquainted with the work of the D. V. O. there to speak from personal observation? Dr. LITTLE. Well, of course, I come in contact with all of the departments in the office. The D. V. O. has his office on another floor. We occupy the fifth and sixth floors, so that in a way we are separated, but I have a chance to observe the general―― The CHAIRMAN (interposing). If there were complaints, do you think that you would know of them? Mr. LITTLE. May I ask, Complaints of what nature? The CHAIRMAN. Complaints of delay or complaints of lack of sympathy for the soldier who might make application or complaints that they are not agreed as to policy, lack of teamwork; would you know of such complaints if there were any? Dr. LITTLE. Certainly; anything pertaining to the soldier I believe I should hear of, because some member of the medical department comes in contact practically with every man who comes in the office. The CHAIRMAN. If there was any friction in the office among the employees, would you know of it? Dr. LITTLE. Not, I believe, to the extent that members of other sections would know. The CHAIRMAN. Do you know of anything of that kind yourself? Dr. LITTLE. I have never heard of any friction until within the last five or six days, and that particular case, from my own observation, it seems to be not a general affair at all, but simply friction between the D. V. O. and one or two of his subordinates. The CHAIRMAN. Do you know Mr. Herbst? Dr. LITTLE. Yes, sir. The CHAIRMAN. Very well? Dr. LITTLE. Very well: yes, sir. The CHAIRMAN. How is the office getting along? The CHAIRMAN. I had some information from the office that leads me to think there is not entire teamwork there. Dr. LITTLE. I believe that information, from my own observation of the work of the office, could hardly be substantiated. I have been in similar work for the past year, since my discharge from the Army, and I have been sent to three different assignments, and from the smoothness with which the work goes through, I do not believe I have been in an office where there seemed to be better cooperation or efficiency. The CHAIRMAN. What were your assignments? Dr. LITTLE. I was first assigned to the chief medical officer of the Bureau of War Risk Insurance and was here until October, and in October I was assigned to the central office of the board at Washington, and from there sent to the Cincinnati office. The CHAIRMAN. What is the general attitude of the D. V. O. at Cincinnati toward the applicants themselves? Dr. LITTLE. The applicants? The CHAIRMAN. Yes, sir. Lr. LITTLE. I should say that he is overlenient. The CHAIRMAN. Can a man be overlenient with these cases? Dr. LITTLE. Well, I do not know whether that would be the word to use or not, but we always attempt to give the man the benefit of the doubt but there are cases which come up where there is no apparent handicap. While the man desires training and there is no doubt about the man's desire to go into the work of the Federal |