So that raises this whole point of the relativity of the right to strike in a regulated industry that is vital to the successful prosecution of the war. But it is the position of your Government, and I share that position, that under these circumstances a fair settlement should be worked out for the workers without allowing them to exercise their absolute right to strike when there is the decision of your Government that the public interest is superior under these particular facts and circumstances.

Certainly you would have a right to strike if we were in a peacetime situation and you would not find me so arguing if we were in that position.

I want the record on behalf of the administration to show that this is the philosophy of the administration, up to this hour, at least, in regard to the administration's responsibility to the public, to ask for legislation to provide a procedure that will settle the case, fairly, with

out resort to a strike.

I have great respect for your advocacy. You have been an able advocate here this morning. You have drawn the lines of differences between the position of the brotherhoods and the position of your Government, the executive branch of Government, as of this hour.

I want you to understand that I shall continue to carry out the policy of the administration not only because of assignment but because in my judgment we are offering a procedure here that I believe will result in what the railroad workers themselves, as well as the general public, will agree is a fair and just settlement. At least, it will be to that end; it will be to try to accomplish that end that I seek to do what I am doing in this case, running always with the understanding, you very well know, that one in my position is bound to run with when I follow this course of action.

I have no right to make these statements without your having the privilege to make a comment.

Mr. LEIGHTY. You mentioned the 1941 Emergency Board. You undoubtedly will recall the 1943 Emergency Board made a recommendation which both the railroads and the organizations agreed to, and made a settlement in accordance therewith, and then Mr. Byrnes, who was serving as Director of Stabilization, I believe we called it, vetoed that settlement. There was a case in which the Government itself prevented the operation of a settlement under the Emergency Board procedure even though the arbitrators in that case, appointed by the President, did certify in their recommendations, that it was in accord with the stabilization policy.

Senator MORSE. I think you will also recall that you did not find then private citizen Wayne Morse approving that course of action on the part of the Government.

Mr. LEIGHTY. We were discussing, as I understood it, the efficacy of an Emergency Board. Here was a Board that came down with something that was acceptable to both parties and the Government refused to accept it, which they had the right to do.

Senator MORSE. I happen to think that when the Government is a party to carrying out its responsibility under the National Railway

Labor Act it ought to consider itself bound by the results of the exercise of those procedures, too.

Mr. LEIGHTY. You also recall the President then did arrange for a settlement which recognized several factors.

Senator MORSE. He was somewhat disturbed, you will recall. He never should have been put in that dilemma.

Is there anything else?

Mr. LEIGHTY. No.

Senator MORSE. Mr. Schoene, I am sorry we could not hear you this afternoon. We will hear you at 10 o'clock Monday morning.

Mr. SCHOENE. I will be very glad to be here.

Senator MORSE. We stand in recess until 10 o'clock Monday morning.

(The following material was supplied for the record :)

RAILWAY LABOR EXECUTIVES' ASSOCIATION,

Washington, D.C., November 10, 1959.

Col. EARL C. HEDLUND, USAF,
Director of Transportation, Office, Deputy Chief of Staff, Materiel, Headquarters,
USAF, Washington, D.C.

DEAR COLONEL HEDLUND: You will recall that in recent discussions between representatives of our Association, the Association of American Railroads, Military Traffic Management Agency, and the Air Force concerning the ability of the Railroad Industry to provide uninterrupted service in support of the Air Force MINUTEMAN missile program, I assured you that the members and officers of the Railway Labor Organizations are patriotic and sincerely devoted to the ideals of our country and could be expected to give paramount consideration to our country's defense needs whatever they might be and under all circumstances, I also pointed out, however that the organizations whose Chief Executives are affiliated with our Association are all autonomous entities and that I had no authority to make commitments for them. I stated that I would present the matter to the members of our Association at their scheduled meeting in Chicago beginning the week of October 26, 1959.

This I have done and the response was unanimous as I had anticipated.

I advised the other Chief Executives that Mr. Loomis had stated on behalf of railroad managements that if the assurances you sought from Railway Labor were given the managements would not, in the event of a strike, use service to the government as a means of impairing the effectiveness of a strike; that if missile train operations and other services in connnection therewith were required, employes who would normally perform such services would be used under joint management-union arrangements and the services thus made available to the government would not be utilized by management in efforts to handle other traffic.

In your letter of October 23, 1959, you suggest that an understanding along the following lines might be appropriate.

Both railroad management and railroad labor unite in their positive assurance that there will be no delay or interruption in the maintenance, scheduling, dispatching and operation of missile trains in support of the mobile or fixed missile weapon systems as programmed and directed by the United States Air Force, in the event that interruptions to civil rail service are impending or should occur as the result of unresolved differences between railroad management and railroad labor.

With the understanding that railroad managements involved will observe the conditions set forth above, as Mr. Loomis in our conference stated they would, the Railway Labor Organizations affiliated with Railway Labor Executives' Association, subscribe to the assurances as you have formulated it.

Sincerely,

G. E. LEIGHTY, Chairman.

ASSOCIATION OF AMERICAN RAILROADS,
Washington, D.C., November 4, 1959.

Col. EARL C. HEDLUND, USAF,

Director of Transportation,

Office, Deputy Chief of Staff, Materiel,
Headquarters, USAF,

Washington, D.C.

DEAR COLONEL HEDLUND: Replying to your letter of 23 October 1959, with respect to the ability of the Railroad Industry to provide positive uninterrupted service in support of Air Force Minuteman missile program, when and if activated:

You suggest an understanding along the following lines:

Both railroad management and railroad labor unite in their positive assurance that there will be no delay or interruption in the maintenance, scheduling, dispatching and operation of missile trains in support of the mobile or fixed missile weapon systems as programmed and directed by the United States Air Force, in the event that interruptions to civil rail service are impending or should occur as the result of unresolved differences between railroad management and railroad labor.

This will advise you that I am authorized by the Board of Directors of the Association of American Railroads to confirm the above quoted understanding on behalf of its member lines.

I assume you will hear from Mr. Leighty as soon as his group has completed consideration of the matter.

Chairman, Railway Labor Executives Association,
Washington, D.C.

GENTLEMEN: In furtherance of recent exchanges of views between representatives of your organizations, Military Traffic Management Agency and the Air Force with respect to the ability of the Railroad Industry to provide positive uninterrupted service in support of Air Force MINUTEMAN missile program when and if activated, it is suggested that an understanding along the following lines might be appropriate.

"Both railroad management and railroad labor unite in their positive assurance that there will be no delay or interruption in the maintenance, scheduling, dispatching and operation of missile trains in support of the mobile or fixed missile weapon systems as programmed and directed by the United States Air Force, in the event that interruptions to civil rail service are impending or should occur as the result of unresolved differences between railroad management and railroad labor."

It should be fully understood that the Air Force must be assured of timely and positive operation of this weapon system under all circumstances other than those attributable to acts of God.

In the event that your organization might wish further information with respect to our MINUTEMAN missile program, we would be happy to arrange such a presentation at the appropriate time.

Your response to the above proposal is requested so that the Air Force may proceed in its assessment of the feasibility of utilizing the nation's railroads as an integral part of a weapon system.

Sincerely,

(S) Earl C. Hedlund

EARL C. HEDLUND,

Colonel, USAF, Director of Transportation,

Office, Deputy of Staff, Materiel.

RAILROAD SHOPCRAFT DISPUTE

MONDAY, MAY 15, 1967

U.S. SENATE,

SUBCOMMITTEE ON LABOR OF THE

COMMITTEE ON LABOR AND PUBLIC WELFARE,

Washington, D.C.

The subcommittee met at 10 a.m., pursuant to recess, in room 4232, New Senate Office Building, Senator Ralph Yarborough (chairman of the subcommittee) presiding.

Present: Senators Yarborough, Morse, Randolph, Pell, Fannin, and Griffin.

Committee staff members present: Stewart E. McClure, chief clerk; Robert O. Harris, counsel to the Labor Subcommittee; Gene Godley, professional staff member; Eugene Mittelman, minority counsel; and Peter Benedict, minority labor counsel.

Senator YARBOROUGH. Gentleman, the subcommittee will come to order.

This is a continuation of the hearings on Senate Joint Resolution 81, an act to provide for the settlement of labor disputes between certain carriers by railroad and certain of their employees.

The first witness this morning is Mr. Schoene, general counsel of the Railway Labor Executives Association. Mr. Schoene.

STATEMENT OF LESTER P. SCHOENE, GENERAL COUNSEL, RAILWAY LABOR EXECUTIVES ASSOCIATION; ACCOMPANIED BY MICHAEL MARSH, DIRECTOR OF RESEARCH

Mr. SCHOENE. Mr. Chairman and members of the committee, my name is Lester P. Schoene. I am a lawyer with offices at 1625 K Street Northwest, Washington, D.C., a member of the firm of Schoene & Kramer.

We have represented the Railway Labor Executives Association and constituent organizations on a variety of matters for a period well in excess of 20 years.

I am appearing, as the chairman announced, as counsel for the Railway Labor Executives Association, which is the same organization whose chairman, Mr. Leighty, appeared here on Friday.

I am accompanied, as Mr. Leighty was, by Mr. Michael Marsh, the director of research of the Railway Labor Executives Association.

I had hoped that Mr. Leighty also would be able to accompany me but he is out of the city and unable to get back on account of weather conditions.