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Mr. SCRIVNER. Who requested that?
Mr. SCRIVNER. Does not the Army Map Service have sufficient funds so that if that is so important they could at least transfer some of their funds to you so that you could make those things available?
Dr. Evans. They do not accept responsibility, sir, and get funds from you for the purpose.
Mr. SCRIVNER. The Army and the Navy and the Air Force and the State Department all transfer funds to you every year for purposes relating to the Library, do they not?
Dr. Evans. A few of them do, sir, for special projects.
Mr. SCRIVNER. All right. This would be a special project. I merely asked you the question that if that were so important to them they could transfer some funds to you so that you could make that service available.
Dr. Evans. I think the reason, sir, would be that their appropriation language does not include sufficient authority and sufficient money to buy the books that would be required.
Mr. SCRIVNER. That is not what you are asking for there. You are not asking for books.
Dr. Evans. They ask us for materials. In some cases we have it and have supplied the information, but in some cases we do not have the material that is necessary.
Mr. SCRIVNER. It is hard for me to believe that there has not been sufficient funds provided for the armed services for the purpose of maps or anything else they deem necessary. They have a special item of books and publications. If they do not have it it should be within their province to tell the Armed Services Appropriations Committee that they are short.
Dr. Evans. I cannot answer that authoritatively, Mr. Scrivner, because I am not aware of what their appropriations are or what their plans are regarding the development of their libraries.
I do know that as of now all the libraries are inadequate to meet the total demands which are being made, and my theory has been, and I think the theory of Congress has been, that except for small collections of much-needed material that they knew they would have to have, the agencies have been relying on the Library of Congress.
Mr. SCRIVNER. Do you have any statement to indicate what funds have been transferred to the Library of Congress by other branches of Government last year?
Dr. Evans. We have that information.
TRANSFERS OF FUNDS FROM OTHER AGENCIES FOR SPECIAL PROJECTS
Mr. SCRIVNER. My information is that those transfers have been a considerable sum.
Dr. Evans. Yes, sir; but practically none of it has been for the purchase of books or answering of questions asked us by Congress or Government agencies in general. It has been for special projects.
Mr. SCRIVNER. I am talking now about your other branches of Government. I am not talking about Congress. I am talking about the State Department and the Defense Department. I understand that Congress asks the Congressional Library many questions. That was the original and the prime purpose of the establishment of the
Library, to have a fund of information available to the Members of Congress.
REQUEST FROM ARMY FOR SPECIAL MAP Dr. Evans. We got a request from the United States Army the other day for a large-scale map of Korea, 1 to 50,000. The only set of those maps in Washington was in the Library of Congress. We happened to have those. There are a great many things like that however, which we do not have.
Mr. SCRIVNER. After we had troops in Korea south of the thirtyeighth parallel from 1945 on, that is the only 1-to-50,000 map there was?
Dr. Evans. Yes, sir. That is what G-2 of the United States Army told the Library of Congress.
Mr. SCRIVNER. That is certainly hard to believe.
Mr. McGRATH. Have you the letter from G-2 saying that is the only map?
Dr. Evans. This is a record of a telephone call, sir.
Dr. Evans. I do not know. This memorandum is made up only of things that have happened in the past 2 weeks.
Mr. SCRIVNER. Somebody ought to know.
Mr. SCRIVNER. I suggest, Mr. Chairman, that they put in a call to find out. I am very curious about that.
Mr. ADKINSON. I will get that.
TRANSFERS OF FUNDS FROM OTHER AGENCIES
Dr. Evans. We have had funds transferred. As of February 1 last the amount available for fiscal years 1948 though 1951 was $1,785,000, but each of those was for some specific project which did not include the acquisition of this kind of material or the giving of service on this kind of material.
There may have been a little under the State Department SCC program that would have applied to this area.
Mr. CLAPP. I do not know.
Mr. CLAPP. That is right. One of the transfers of funds from the State Department under its information program related to the exchange of materials with Latin America. The State Department's interest is to get American materials into Latin America on a cooperative basis. The reason we handle it is merely because we get stuff in return for whatever is sent down. As a matter of fact, we get more back than we send down in the numebr of pieces, and actually show a profit on the transaction. That is the only one of all these funds which has resulted in acquisition. That is a very important one.
I believe it is true that if we had not been having that State Department transfer for several years we might have asked for funds to develop such an exchange arrangement ourselves.
If I might go on a minute, Mr. Chairman, I feel that Mr. Scrivner does not quite understand the background of these services generally. When we do get transfers from other agencies, sir, it is always for a very specific project, depending upon our collections. It is because the Air Force, for example, does not have the collections upon which researches are to be based that they transfer money to us to make the researches, merely because it is easier to do it in our own building than it is to haul all that material over to the Pentagon. Actually it is an Air Force transaction, making use of our materials.
All this work of building up that collection, all this work of cataloging, and all this work of making it available is our regular job. We ought not do it just for the Air Force. We ought to do it for the Air Force and the Army and the Navy and the State Department and all the other agencies of Government in Washington, and we ought to be doing it also for the use of every university in the country which may have similar needs, and for every individual who may have similar needs.
Mr. SCRIVNER. I do not think the Congressional Library is asked to go that far. If you would stop where you talk about the Government agencies I could go along with you.
Mr. CLAPP. If I may say so, sir, my viewpoint is this: Here is this material. It ought to be given the widest possible use.
Mr. SCRIVNER. You have your cataloging cards.
Mr. SCRIVNER. If these library schools and individuals want to know about it, you have cataloging cards which are available to them.
Mr. ClApp. Correct. That is one of the best things we do. If I may say so, sir, Congress has itself by statute made our collections available to people outside the District of Columbia. That is written into our basic law.
Mr. SCRIVNER. I understand that.
SPECIAL REQUEST FOR KOREAN MAP
Dr. EVANS. Mr. Chairman, I have been glancing through these two pages which I have here of sample items.
Mr. CANFIELD. Before we go into another item let me interrupt. Dr. Evans. I wanted to speak on maps.
Mr. CANFIELD. This is on maps. Will you be good enough to repeat to the committee what you said about the lack of Korean maps in the Department of the Army? Do I understand your testimony to be that the Army wanted a certain type of map and the Library of Congress was the only place in which there was such a map, and there was only one?
Dr. Evans. The information, sir, is by telephone, I believe.
Dr. Evans. It is being verified. It is from someone in G-2 in the United States Army, who requested a large scale set of Korean maps. That is the 1 to 50,000. That is 1 inch to 50,000 inches.
The note says here:
They stated they have been unable to locate such a set in any other Government agency.
That is all I have, until we get more data on the telephone call. Mr. CANFIELD. Doctor, when did you receive that request?
Dr. Evans. Sometime within the past 2 weeks, but they are looking to see just when it was. This note is dated today, the 13th.
Mr. CANFIELD. I desire to make this observation right here: If that be true that is a severe indictment of the Department of the Army and its Map Service.
Mr. MCGRATH. Well, of course, you are giving this committee a hearsay statement which somebody has told you that somebody else said it was the only map. You as a former professor of law would not give that type of testimony very much credence, would you?
Dr. Evans. I am not testifying, sir, to the fact that this is true. Mr. McGRATH. Somebody has told you.
Dr. EVANS. All I was trying to testify to, when I began, was that we have had certain requests. We had a request for the Korean maps which we satisfied. We have had requests for numbers of other things.
I do not have the details as to all of them that we were able to satisfy but some of them we were not able to satisfy.
Mr. MCGRATH. Upon that statement, then, you are asking this committee to appropriate money. In making the statement to the committee you have not made any effort to determine the truth or falsity of it, have you?
Dr. Evans. Mr. Chairman, this is merely illustrative material which I have thrown in after
my statement. Mr. MCGRATH. I agree with you that it is thrown in.
Dr. EVANS. I do testify to the accuracy of the general allegations made bere, that there is not in any Government agency in Washington an adequate collection from these countries that are mentioned here.
Mr. SCRIVNER. My contention was that the language in the appropriation for the military services is plenty broad so that if they need this they have the funds with which to get it either directly or by a transfer of funds to you, asking you to get it for them.
Dr. Evans. Let me ask Mr. Scrivner this question: Does he recommend that Congress adopt the principle that each agency who has asked us a question I am going to speak of should have the material to answer these questions?
Mr. SCRIVNER. We are talking now about the military. We are talking about the Korean map. I maintain, yes, that the War Department should have a supply of maps covering the countries they are concerned with, particularly where we have had troops in that country over the period since the date of the Japanese surrender.
Mr. CANFIELD. And I concur in that statement. Dr. Evans, I believe your aide is now here. Perhaps, he has verified the report you have given us. I think it appropriate that we hear from him now, or hear from him through you.
Mr. ADKINSON. Major Brown of Military Intelligence called a clerk in the Map Division and asked for the Korean version of the 1 to 50,000 map of Korea and when we told him we had it, he said that was the only copy available to G-2 in Washington.
Mr. SCRIVNER. What was the date of that call?
Mr. ADKINSON. That call was on July 6. I can add one thing more. Army Map Service has some Anglicized versions which are available, but this is the only Korean one available to G-2 in the city. That was Major Brown's statement to the clerk.
Mr. SCRIVNER. What do you mean by Korean?
Mr. ADKINSON. It is the map that the Koreans had prepared 1 to 50,000—the Korean Government. And they were going back to the source to check.
Dr. Evans. With the Korean language on it, I suppose?
Mr. ADKINSON. That is correct; probably the Japanese language on it. It was prepared by the Korean Government.
Mr. CANFIELD. That bears out Dr. Evans' testimony and I wish to repeat, it is an awful indictment of the Department of the Army and its Map Service.
OTHER EXAMPLES OF RECENT REQUESTS
Dr. Evans. I am bothered by this doctrine, because if it is carried to its logical conclusion, I think there would be a great deal of duplication of holdings among the agencies of the Government. We have gotten a request on Korean weather from the Air Force. That requires maps.
Mr. SCRIVNER. Yes; and our Air Force was in Korea from September 8, 1945, for a period of 2 years or more. That is what is so difficult for me to understand. Having been in there, with our occupying troops, with our Air Force, with our naval forces for that length of time, they themselves did not have that information somewhere. Of course, perhaps it is easier to understand under the philosophy of the last 2 or 3 years, that Korea was unimportant, and maybe they disposed of them. I do not know what happened to them. But I am quite sure that, having been there that long a time, as liberation troops, our troops had to have much of that information; at least they would have had some need for it. And it is difficult for me to understand why they would not have had it after that period of time in Korea as liberation troops. That is what puzzles me; not so much that you got the request, but the reason for the request.
Dr. EVANS. We had a long distance call from a private company inquiring where Korean maps might be purchased. They were not asking for our maps. We had a request from the United Nations for six copies of maps of Korea. We had a request from a Senator for the populations of the larger Kore in towns and their distances from Fusan. We had a call from the Geological Survey for two maps of Korea. We had a call from the Hawaiian Delegate for airline distances from Hawaii to Korea. That would be fairly simple.
We had a request from the House Committee on Foreign Affairs for a physical map of Korea. We had a request from the Alaskan Delegate for the airline distances from Alaska to Korea. We had two requests that are noted here from the Legislative Reference Service that was working on the problem for Congress.
If these agencies each set out to do it, they probably could build up their collections on any particular country, but it seems to me, gentlemen, that it is much cheaper for the entire Government to have it done in one place. But it should not be done in one place unless that place does its job well and has the material.