General HERSHEY. That is right.

Mr. THOMAS. And it is to cover the induction and the necessary expenses thereto of 185,000 inductees during the fiscal year 1951? General HERSHEY. Yes.

Mr. THOMAS. It does not take much imagination to foretell that the 185,000 will be merely the beginning, and that is the reason I asked you awhile ago if you were speaking with prophetic vision.

We will insert in the record at this point pages 1 and 2 of the justifications.

(The justification pages referred to are as follows:)

GENERAL STATEMENT

There is transmitted herewith the justification for the estimated appropriation requirements of the Selective Service System for the fiscal year 1951 as approved by the President.

The Selective Service Act of 1948, which was scheduled to expire on June 24, 1950, was extended until July 9, 1950, by Public Law 572, Eighty-first Congress. On July 9, 1950, the Selective Service Act of 1948 was extended by Public Law 599, Eighty-first Congress, until July 9, 1951.

During the fiscal year 1950 the Selective Service System, due to its limited appropriation, was forced to curtail its operations and contract its organization by consolidating local board offices and eliminating a large percentage of its clerical help. The System was reduced to a point where it was merely a skeletonized stand-by organization incapable of producing men for the Armed Forces. The System has now been called upon to furnish 20,000 men to the Armed Forces at the earliest opportunity. The Bureau of the Budget has authorized the Selective Service System to use 185,000 as the total number of inductees to be called during the fiscal year 1951 and as a basis for requesting funds. With world conditions as they now exist, this number may be found entirely inadequate. In order to meet the demands placed upon the System it is imperative that an immediate expansion of its organization be made, both as to the number of offices and the number of employees. As of June 30, 1950, the organization consisted of a national headquarters, 54 State headquarters, 54 Federal record depots, and 3,659 local boards housed in 2,531 locations. The employment as of that date included 179 at national headquarters; 828 at State headquarters, including the Federal record depots; and 564 full time and 2,110 part time employed in the local boards.

The amount of funds requested will provide for increasing the number of local board offices by 900, making the total number of offices 3,431, in which will be housed the 3,659 local boards. Provision has also been made to increase the number of employees at National headquarters to 285; at State headquarters to 1,198; at local boards to 4,366, and to establish 54 appeal board offices.

The funds requested will be sufficient to finance an organization capable of inducting 185,000 men, however, it is emphasized that any change in the existing legislation or in the number of men to be called will of necessity require a review of this agency's fiscal requirements in light of such changes.

The two largest items of expense for the System are those for selectee travel and local board personal services. Expense for selectee travel is directly related to the number of men called and the rate of rejections, and is an expense over which there is no control. The estimate for local board personal services will provide the number of compensated personnel required to meet the demands placed upon the local boards under the assumptions used. The local boards, being the backbone of the System, must be adequately staffed if men are to be furnished the Armed Forces in the numbers requested. It should be remembered that in addition to the compensated personnel in the local boards there are presently 37,000 uncompensated citizens of this country who unstintingly devote their time and services so that the work of Selective Service may be carried on

in their respective communities in a just and impartial manner. These uncompensated citizens depend on the compensated personnel to do the detail paper work in connection with the registration, examination, classification, and induction of men and they are rightfully entitled to expect that sufficient compensated personnel be provided. The Selective Service System is unlike other governmental agencies in that its functions are carried out by the citizenry of this country united in a common cause. The compensated personnel of the System are necessary to coordinate the activities and serve those participating. Insufficient compensated local board personnel prevents the local boards from keeping their work current, one of the results being the forwarding of men for examination who are obviously unfit for military service. This places an additional expense on the taxpayers of this country which could be avoided if local boards were sufficiently staffed.

In view of the uncertainty regarding extension of the Selective Service Act, request for funds was made by the President for the operation of the Office of Selective Service Records only, in the amount of $6,454,000. The House Appropriations Committee approved funds in the amount of $4,954,000, which is the amount contained in H. R. 7786, for the operation of the Office of Selective Service Records. The proposed appropriation language for the Selective Service System provides for the transfer of the funds to be appropriated the Office of Selective Service Records to the Selective Service System.

The estimate herewith submitted is for an amount of $25,430,000. Deducting the amount to be appropriated the Office of Selective Service Records ($4,954,000), which amount if transferred to the Selective Service System, leaves an additional appropriation amounting to $20,476,000 for the consideration of Congress.

NUMBER OF EMPLOYEES

Mr. THOMAS. Now, let us get down to the meat in the coconut and let me give you some facts for the record.

As of June 30, 1950, your organization consisted of a national headquarters here in Washington, 54 State headquarters, 54 Federal record depots, and 3,659 local boards housed in 2,531 locations. That means that you had in some six or seven hundred cities more than one board. In the employment as of that date there were included 179 in national headquarters, 828 at State headquarters, including the Federal records depots, 564 full-time and 2,110 part-time employees in the local boards. That gives you a total as of now of 3,681 employees; is that correct? General HERSHEY. That is correct. That is not counting whether they are full time or not.

Mr. THOMAS. Including 2,110 part time, that will give you 3,681? General HERSHEY. That is correct.

Mr. THOMAS. Under this appropriation how many do you have? General HERSHEY. We are asking for 5,849. That is the total, including the National and State.

Mr. THOMAS. Your total estimate for 1951 will be $25,430,000?
General HERSHEY. Yes.

Mr. THOMAS. Of which amount $4,954,000 is in the regular bill?
General HERSHEY. That is correct.

Mr. THOMAS. What you are seeking today is $20,476,000?

General HERSHEY. That is right, presuming that we get the total of $4,954,000 without a reduction.

SUMMARY BY OBJECT CLASSIFICATION

Mr. THOMAS. At this point in the record we will insert pages 3 and

8 of the justifications.

(The justification tables referred to are as follows:)

State headquarters (including appeal boards and Federal record depots)

Mr. THOMAS. We will now take up the national headquarters. I note that in the national headquarters you have 179 personnel and you want, for the fiscal year 1951, 285.

General HERSHEY. Correct. That includes our regional offices. Mr. THOMAS. That is a jump of some 91 people.

General HERSHEY. Something like that.

Mr. THOMAS. Why the increase now?

General HERSHEY. Well, we have to activate our regional headquarters.

Mr. THOMAS. We are speaking about the national headquarters

now.

General HERSHEY. That includes our regional. We have only three levels. We have the National, the State

Mr. THOMAS. You have six regional offices.

General HERSHEY. The personnel for those offices is in the national headquarters.

Mr. THOMAS. Of the 179, how many do you have in the District of Columbia and the six regional offices, and where are they located? General HERSHEY. At the present time we have 12 in the regional offices, and they are located in Boston, Washington, Atlanta, Chicago, Austin, and San Francisco. There has to be some little increase in those offices.

Mr. THOMAS. You say that you have 12 in those six regional offices? Do you mean that you have 12 in each one of them?

General HERSHEY. Two in each one; a total of 12.

Mr. THOMAS. That gives you a total of 167 in the District of Columbia?

General HERSHEY. That is right.

Mr. THOMAS. What are the 167 people doing in the District of Columbia now? How many are Army officers on detail?

General HERSHEY. Forty-four officers.

Mr. THOMAS. How many National Guard or Reserve officers do you have out of that 167?

General HERSHEY. All but one.

Mr. THOMAS. Are your Regular Army people paid from the Army appropriation, or are they paid from this appropriation?

General HERSHEY. Last year the Army paid it, but there is money in here to pay for everyone we get, whether they be in the Reserve or Regular. I am the only Regular officer over there. I am retired and back on active duty.

Mr. THOMAS. I thought you said that you had 44 Regulars.

General HERSHEY. Forty-four Reserve and National Guard officers. I have one medical officer. There are two of us. Both of us are retired and on active duty. All the rest are National Guard and Reserves. Mr. THOMAS. That gives you about 125 civilian personnel. General HERSHEY. Yes.

Mr. THOMAS. What are they doing?

General HERSHEY. They operate the finance and supply for the whole system. They operate the printing, the reproduction, the distribution of the whole system. They operate the issuance, or at least the recommendation, of regulations and the sending out of the calls; the supervision that they get from here. The instructions that go to the local boards are all formulated here, written and distributed from this point. The supervision that we exercise over our State headquarters is centered here, although they do have their regional offices in addition to the field office here.

Mr. THOMAS. What function do they perform?

General HERSHEY. The regional offices and the field office here are the only method and means that the National Director has of knowing what is going on any place.

Mr. THOMAS. Do we not have a mail service?

General HERSHEY. Yes. Who would mail the report?

Mr. THOMAS. In other words, we have one thing in mind-we are going to give you everything that you ought to have in your local office where the work is done, but we are not going to let you build up big State headquarters or regional headquarters, or a big one here in Washington, and we are going to be perfectly frank about it. You want an increase of about 85 percent?

General HERSHEY. That is right; which is very modest. I do not want to go back to the past, but one of the reasons why men do not report when they should is because at the present time I find myself confronted with a backlog in the way of demand for men that is just thrown upon a skeleton. I consider the amount very modest. Obviously, I shall take what I can get, but the responsibility for my ability to work will rest where I ask for means and do not get them.

Mr. THOMAS. What about the pay of your personnel here in the District of Columbia?

General HERSHEY. Everything is included.

Mr. THOMAS. $1,249,212.

General HERSHEY. Yes.

Mr. THOMAS. Why should not the Army pay for its own personnel? General HERSHEY. We have argued that before. I said that the man who spends the money and uses it should be responsible for the total thing, and the Congress in authorizing legislation has left out of the Army's ceiling the people who serve with me. I think that it was the intention of the people who passed that law that when I borrowed personnel I should account for them financially and not. have hidden in my budget some services that I got for nothing. I think that is sound now.

Mr. THOMAS. Let us see how sound it is. If you have military personnel over here, you pay for heat, light, and quarters and subsistence in addition to the Regular Army pay, do you not?

General HERSHEY. That is right.

Mr. THOMAS. If you have a civilian in there doing comparable work, do you give him the same pay and allowances?

General HERSHEY. Sometimes it works both ways. I have captains that are doing jobs that probably it would take an F-13 to do, up in the $7,000 area. That does not necessarily always happen. Sometimes we may have colonels that may be doing things that a 13 might do, or even a 12.

Mr. THOMAS. This seems to me to be purely a civilian function and I do not know why you should have highly trained military personnel doing it.

General HERSHEY. Mr. Thomas, I do not want to be argumentative, but since 1917 they have consistently had in the Selective Service System military personnel. In 1926 when the Secretary of War and the Secretary of the Navy organized the Joint Army and Navy Selective Service System, they selected National Guard and Reserve officers to be trained in peacetime to operate in wartime in the Selective Service System. In 1940 the Congress recognized the existence of those people and wrote special legislation so that those people when serving in this organization would not lose any of their emoluments or status that they had otherwise. We went through World War II. We made mistakes but on the whole we were normally successful. At the present time the only people that we have trained to train in the last 5 years are the people in the National Guard and the Reserve. The National Guard is peculiarly in a place where they can keep in touch with the Governors of the States, and when we get into trouble we call upon the Governors to handle the Selective Service System. I do not believe after you get into a thing that you plan to get into you should start replanning.

Mr. THOMAS. Certainly there can be no quibbling about your National Guard.

General HERSHEY. Some of these officers are National Guards men. Mr. THOMAS. There is quite a distinction between a National Guards man and a Regular Army officer.

General HERSHEY. Yes.