Mr. STAFFORD. Do these clerks represent those who are now employed in your office? Mr. MERITT. Yes, sir. Mr. STAFFORD. You have no additional ones? Mr. MERITT. We have 250 employees provided for in the legislative bill, and then we have 16 employees in the office who are engaged in determining the heirs of deceased Indians under an item carried in the Indian appropriation act. That item gives us specific authority to use not to exceed $25,000 of that $100,000 appropriation for the purpose of employing clerks in the Indian Office in connection with that work. Mr. STAFFORD. Where do you get those clerks to perform that work? Mr. MERITT. We get them from the civil service. Mr. STAFFORD. You have no clerks detailed to your bureau from other bureaus? Mr. MERITT. No, sir. Mr. BYRNS. How long has that work been going on? Mr. MERITT. About three years. Mr. BYRNS. Then you have nearly used up the $100,000? Mr. MERITT. We have an appropriation of $100,000 each year, and we are using out of that appropriation at this time $24,400 for office work here. We have authority in the Indian appropriation act to use not to exceed $25,000 of the $100,000 appropriated for that purpose. Mr. STAFFORD. For what character of work? Mr. MERITT. It is the work of determining the heirs of deceased. Indians. Mr. BYRNS. It is not expected that that work will continue indefinitely? Mr. MERITT. It will continue for several years yet; we have probably 30,000 cases that have not yet been decided; they are coming up from all parts of the Indian country. DETAILED EMPLOYEES. Mr. STAFFORD. You have no clerks on this roll detailed to any other office? Mr. MERITT. We have one clerk who is detailed to the Interior Department proper. He is in the disbursing officer's office; he is temporarily detailed to that office at this time. Mr. STAFFORD. How long has he been detailed there? Mr. STAFFORD. What salary does he receive? Mr. MERITT. $2,000. He is passing on accounts from our office. Mr. STAFFORD. He is virtually attached to that office? Mr. MERITT. Yes, sir; he is connected with that office. Mr. STAFFORD. Why should not his position be eliminated from your bureau and charged up to the disbursing clerk? Mr. MERITT. If they will provide for him in their estimates, that will be satisfactory to us. Mr. STAFFORD. That is the only instance? Mr. MERITT. We have one other employee who is detailed to the General Land Office; he is doing part of our work and part of the General Land Office work. He is a draftsman, and I think he does photographic work. Mr. STAFFORD. How long has he been detailed? Mr. MERITT. He has been there nearly two years. Mr. STAFFORD. He is virtually attached to that office? Mr. MERITT. Well, he is doing part of our work and part of the General Land Office work. Mr. STAFFORD. But he is attached to that office? Mr. MERITT. Yes, sir. Mr. STAFFORD. He is under their supervision? Mr. MERITT. Yes, sir. Mr. STAFFORD. And he should really be included in that bureau? Mr. MERITT. Yes, sir. PAY OF FORESTER. Mr. BYRNS. In order that we may be able to satisfy anybody that may inquire about it, why is it that you propose to reduce this forester from $3,000 to $2,500? Mr. MERITT. The position of forester has not been filled for more than a year; the forester we had resigned and went back to the Forest Service. We have a man, a field man, who is acting temporarily as forester, and his salary is $2,500. We feel that the salary of the forester should be $2,500 in order to make the salaries as nearly uniform as possible. If the forester drew $3,000 he would be drawing $250 more than our chief clerk, and the office believed that $2,500 would be an adequate salary. PENSION OFFICE. THURSDAY, NOVEMBER 30, 1916. STATEMENT OF MR. G. M. SALTZGABER, COMMISSIONER OF PENSIONS, ACCOMPANIED BY MR. F. D. BYINGTON, CHIEF CLERK. Mr. BYRNS. Mr. Commissioner, you have submitted an estimate for the same amount for the year 1918 as is carried for the current year? Mr. SALTZGABER. Yes, sir. Mr. BYRNS. How many vacancies exist in the Pension Office at this time under this provision of law? Mr. SALTZGABER. Twenty-two. I have a list of them here. Mr. BYRNS. With the salaries? Mr. SALTZGABER. Yes, sir. Mr. BYRNS. You might read that list for the benefit of the committee. Mr. SALTZGABER. This is as of November 29. Vacancies existing in the Pension Office November 29, 1916. Mr. BYRNS. How many vacancies were there existing on June 30 of this year? Mr. BYINGTON. None. We started out with a clean sheet. Mr. SALTZGABER. By death, resignation, and transfer. Mr. BYRNS. How many of them by reason of death? Mr. BYINGTON. Most of them by death. I can not tell you exactly. Mr. BYRNS. How many vacancies have been filled since June 30 of this year? Mr. BYINGTON. Not one. Mr. BYRNS. You have not filled any? Mr. BYINGTON. No, sir. Mr. SALTZGABER. Not because we did not want to but because we could not get the messengers that we wanted and needed and the stenographers that we needed very badly. We could only get them in the grades in which there were vacancies. Mr. BYRNS. How many details have you from your office to other offices of the department? Mr. SALTZGABER. Seventeen. Mr. BYRNS. Can you furnish us with a list of those detailed, giving the rates of pay? Mr. SALTZGABER. Yes, sir. Dr. O'Connor, $1,800. He is the sanitary director for the department; eversees the sanitary arrangements in the different buildings and directs what shall be done. Mr. Cobb is with the Committee on Pensions of the House. Mr. Kerr is with the Committee on Pensions in the Senate. Mr. Allen is with the Secretary. Mr. Clarke is with the Secretary. Mr. Ives is with the House Pension Committee. Mr. McClain is with the Secretary. In fact, all the others are with the Secretary. Mr. STAFFORD. Can you tell us what their salaries are, assigned to Congress? Mr. SALTZGABER (reading)— O'Connor, C. E., M. E.... those not Cobb, W. McK.' $1,800 West, J. T.1 1,800 Scott, S.Y.". $1,400 1, 200 840 840 720 720 400 400 whose salaries are paid on the rolls of the Pension Office and are detailed to the offices as shown in footnotes below. No details to this office. Mr. BYRNS. About how long have these details existed? Mr. SALTZGABER. Since I have been in the office. I can not tell you how much longer, except as to Mr. Kerr, Mr. Cobb, and Mr. Ives. Mr. Cobb and Mr. Ives have been detailed since I came to the office. 1 Secretary's office. 2 Capitol. General Supply Committee. Solicitor's office. Mr. BYINGTON. And most of the details to the Secretary's office were in existence when the commissioner took charge. Mr. BYRNS. Are there any details to your office? Mr. SALTZGABER. None whatever. There never has been any. Mr. BYRNS. What is the present status of the work of your office, Mr. Commissioner; is it current or up to date? Mr. SALTZGABER. No, sir; it is not current. It was current prior to the passage of the Ashbrook bill. Mr. BYRNS. That is the widows' pension bill? Mr. SALTZGABER. Yes, sir; we have received under that act for increased allowance 144,143 applications and for original pensions 30,514. We have allowed of that number 117,444. There were disallowances and calls, so they have not been acted on-that leaves 9,091 not acted on of the applications for increase made by widows. The applications for increases have been almost all acted on. So far as calls are necessary, where testimony is required, they are undergoing processes of hearings at different stages. Mr. BYRNS. Do you anticipate any large number of increased applications under the law? Mr. SALTZGABER. We anticipate at least 25,000 more. We have been getting about 1,000 applications a day during the last week. Mr. BYINGTON. We anticipate that there will be 200,000 in all. Mr. STAFFORD. Twenty-five thousand increases, or both originals and increases? Mr. SALTZGABER. I had in mind both. I would not be able to state just how many of one or the other. Our people have labored very diligently, the employees of the office, in order to quickly get rid of the accumulation. The number of applications which came in some days-10,000 to 15.000-just overwhelmed us, but the employees partook of the spirit of the commissioner and went at it most earnestly. Mr. BYRNS. When was the law enacted? Mr. SALTZGABER. On the 8th of September, this year. The increases all date from the 8th of September. Mr. BYRNS. The enactment of this law causes your work to be not exactly up to date? Mr. SALTZGABER. Yes, sir. We were current on other work, but the time we have devoted to that work, of course, has made us a little behind with the other work. Mr. STAFFORD. I read in the papers that some clerk or other official connected with your bureau was visiting in my home city and was advertising to the people to call upon him at the Government building, and that he would give them information concerning the operation of this new law. How many of those traveling men have you had in the field and what character of grade do they fill? Mr. SALTZGABER. We have about 53 or 54. There was a good deal of inquiry after the passage of this law as to what it meant. They were instructed as to its meaning, copies of the law were sent to them, and they were advised wherever they had opportunity to give information. Mr. STAFFORD. What position do they ordinarily fill? Mr. SALTZGABER. They are examiners. Mr. STAFFORD. Are they the special examiners? Mr. SALTZGABER. Yes, sir. Mr. STAFFORD. Their work is abating as the time goes on? Mr. SALTZGABER. No, sir; it is not abating; it is increasing, on account of this new law. We will have a great many age questions to. investigate, and we will have a great many questions of remarriage, and then Congress has required that a woman shall not have a bad reputation if she is to have a pension, and a great many inquiries are made on that account. We make those inquiries for the protection of the Government; they are not for the benefit of the individual. The appropriation we had last year would not pay for the compensation for those special examiners for this year if we require of them as much work as is our duty to the Government. Mr. STAFFORD. What is their compensation? Mr. SALTZGABER. Some of them receive $1,400 and some $1,200. PER DIEM. Mr. SALTZGABER. Yes, sir. We have asked for $4 a day. I understand that that has met the approval of the Secretary. We feel that under the present conditions they are entitled to more than $3 a day. Medal of Honor: We also have the Medal of Honor roll as an addition, but that is not of very great consequence. Up to yesterday there were 329 applications under that act. They get $10 per month in addition to the pension which they otherwise receive. That, of course, makes additional work. I might also say, having in mind the future, that our applications from the regular establishment as we call it is increasing. The Army has increased and the Navy has increased and consequently we are getting applications on account of injuries and loss of health. SPECIAL EXAMINATIONS. Mr. BYRNS. You are asking for an increase of $30,000 for the special examinations? Mr. SALTZGABER. Yes, sir; we believe that is justified. It is not to benefit us alone, but to benefit the Government. That is our notion. about it. Mr. BYRNS. I believe you just stated some of the reasons why it was necessary to make these examinations? Mr. SALTZGABER. Yes, sir. Mr. BYRNS. How many special examiners have you employed at the present time? Mr. SALTZGABER. I can not tell you exactly, but I think 53 is near the number. Mr. BYINGTON. Forty-eight. We have recently called in two. Mr. SALTZGABER. I think we ought to. We have decreased it on account of the appropriation. We found that we were expending more money than we were justified in doing, in view of the limited appropriation. Mr. BYRNS. By the time this act goes into effect, next June, you will have disposed of all of the widows' pensions? |