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livestock-I am in the livestock business, too, Senator-is that your "critter" may be led out and inspected, and our "critter" is in an opaque tin can; and until the consumer has bought and paid her money for that can she can not tell whether she has bought a good or a poor "critter."

Senator KENDRICK. The parallel may be even found between canned goods and dressed meats on the basis that the average customer or consumer is unable to judge as to the quality by the looks of the meat.

As an illustration, the Department of Agriculture, as I recall, initiated a plan here some time ago of branding two classes of dressed beef, choice and prime; and the effect of that was, within a short time, to increase consumption wherever this branded beef was introduced. The public insisted that one reason why they had turned to other kinds of meat products, such as pork and poultry and that sort of thing, was because they were unable to determine as to the quality of beef. This process or plan of branding was continued for perhaps one or two seasons; an appropriation was made for it, and the department seemed to find real encouragement in extending the work; but because of the objection, as I understand, of one or two Congressmen in the House the appropriation was stricken out of the bill after it was included by the Senate Committee on Appropriations.

There would seem to be but one motive for denying the Government the right to try this out, this plan of branding dressed products, and that motive would seem to be only that of selfish interest-that is to say, of selling a lower-grade product to a consumer who was unable to detect the difference at the same price that a first-class product would bring; and that is your trouble in the canning business? Mr. COSGROVE. Yes, sir. We just feel that this is in the interest of fair dealing.

Senator KENDRICK. It seems to me it is entirely all right, save and excepting the discretion of the way the labeling should be done.

Mr. COSGROVE. That is largely discretionary, to be worked out by the Department of Agriculture in the light of their past experience. Senator KENDRICK. Is that provided for in the bill?

Mr. COSGROVE. Yes.

Senator FRAZIER. Is there any further statement you wish to make? Are there any questions from the other Senators? If not, that will be all; thank you.

We shall be glad to hear Doctor Campbell.

STATEMENT OF DR. W. G. CAMPBELL, DIRECTOR OF REGULATORY WORK, UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE

Doctor CAMPBELL. Mr. Chairman, the department's interest in this bill is from the obvious advantage that it possesses for the public. There is little more that I can say than was said in the Secretary's letter to the committee indorsing the bill.

Bear in mind that this measure relates only to products that are legal products that is, not products that are so decidedly inferior that they are adulterated and that their sale and shipment in interstate commerce would be banned. The low-grade products that are legal are labeled perhaps in the same way now that the high-grade products are labeled; and there is no method by which the consumer,

from any information that is contained on the label of the package, can use any discrimination in buying.

The terms of the food and drugs act are general. They do not require uniform labeling. There are only two positive requirements in that act. One is that the quantity of contents shall be declared on food that is in package form; and the other is that products that are imitations must be labeled as imitations.

All of the other provisions of the act are, in a way, negative. It is considered an offense to label a product in a false and misleading manner; but there are no provisions of the law that make it compulsory upon the manufacturer of food products to give information to the consumer with respect to the quality or condition or grade of any commodity.

The situation now is such that, as a matter of concrete illustration, a product may be labeled as peas when put in a can, and they may be the most desirable, the most delectable class of peas that could be put up. On the other hand, they can bear the identical label and be a product so inferior in character that they would not be desirable, and perhaps not altogether edible; but if they are unadulterated there is no action that can be taken by the department under the terms of the law as it is now which would require some statement on the label informing the consumer of the comparatively inferior character of the low-grade products.

This bill proposes to do merely this to authorize the Secretary of Agriculture to promulgate standards for such products; and those articles that fall below that standard—all of which will be legal goods, both the low-grade and the high-grade, provided they are unadulterated-those products that fall below that standard are to be labeled in some appropriate way to indicate to the consumer that they are not the high-grade product, but are the low-grade product.

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Senator KENDRICK. Right there, Mr. Campbell, will it interrupt you to ask you a question?

Doctor CAMPBELL. Not at all, sir.

Senator KENDRICK. Is it your opinion that the enactment of the bill would have any influence in preventing the marketing of a cheaper product, one that would more nearly meet the needs of people unable to buy the first-class product?

Doctor CAMPBELL. I do not think so at all. I think the effect of this proposed legislation would be comparable to the economic results that are obtained through the standardization of all classes of agricultural products.

Senator KENDRICK. And you will agree that the designation on the can should be made with real discretion?

Doctor CAMPBELL. Oh, certainly. It should not be a designation that would stigmatize the product and prevent its sale at all. It would be uneconomic to do that. Such products would be wholesome, but they just would not possess that particular feature that distinguishes between a high-grade and a low-grade product. My idea is that the general effect of enacting this bill would be to bring about a classification in price to the consumer and to the individual who finds this label on the can.

Senator KENDRICK. It could hardly result otherwise, because the designation would compel the classification.

Doctor CAMPBELL. That is true. In other words, this will involve the promulgation of two grades. It contemplates, in effect, the sale by grades the product that will be above a certain standard declared by the Secretary, and the product that will be below that standardwhich is a primary step in the sale of the commodity by grades. In that respect it is merely an extension of the principle that now is found in legislation which authorizes the Secretary of Agriculture to make investigations and to inspect and certify the class, quality, and condition of virtually all types of farm products; and that is being done, as you know, very extensively. It is being done in the case of fruits and in the case of vegetables.

That is an advantage to the farmer. It protects him, in that it places the burden upon the receiver, the commission man, to show that the grade is otherwise than it was sold as being; and it is of advantage to the buyer, because he is buying upon grades, upon specific representations; and the same. advantage that has been found to accrue to him in such circumstances will, if this measure passes, be transmitted to the general public who are unable to make inspections even if they knew how to grade on the basis of such inspections.

The only purpose, the only effect of the bill, will be to make possible an exercise of intelligence in buying; and where it is possible to exercise such intelligence it is fair to presume that there will be discrimination in buying; and where discrimination is possible it operates fairly to the consuming public, and that is the primary interest of the department in its endorsement of the amendment.

Senator KENDRICK. Is it not quite true, in your opinion as having directly to do with this matter of inspection, no doubt, that a great percentage of the goods so canned, and even those that it will be necessary to designate as second grade, will prove just as wholesome as the finer products?

Doctor CAMPBELL. Without a doubt, and just as nutritious.

Senator KENDRICK. And in your opinion would it not be almost necessary to indicate that or give the authority to indicate that on the label?

Doctor CAMPBELL. Yes, sir.

Senator KENDRICK. "Second grade, but entirely wholesome?"
Doctor CAMPBELL. That is right.

Senator FRAZIER. In your opinion, two grades are sufficient?

Doctor CAMPBELL. Yes-well, that is all, I think, that should be undertaken at this time. Here is an instance where an industry, in recognition of the advantages that come to it in the sale of its product on the basis of grades, just as Mr. Cosgrove has discussed, comes to Congress and proposes voluntarily the increase of the power of the Government to regulate its operations because it has understood and does appreciate, as a result of the some twenty years' experience that it has had in marketing its products under the terms of this law, that it has a stabilizing influence. The Department of Agriculture is not asking this now. I can say to you, from the standpoint of my conviction with respect to the principle of this, that I think it would be a good thing if extended to all classes of food products; and I will not compromise the possibility that in the course of time, on the basis of merchandising experience where certain adverse types of competition are encountered that can not now be controlled by •

the terms of the law, other industries may come in and ask for the same thing. But certainly it is of obvious advantage to the consumer. That is our primary concern, and that is the reason why we have indorsed it.

Senator KENDRICK. I think we might very well, in passing upon this legislation, be concerned as to two questions in connection with the effect of the law. One is that the law shall not operate to prevent the sale and even the increased consumption, if necessary, of a perfectly wholesome product that can not be designated as premium. Doctor CAMPBELL. That is right.

Senator KENDRICK. That is an important point; because it would automatically, as I believe, deliver this product as described to the consumer at the price for which it ought to be sold.

Doctor CAMPBELL. That is right. It would be decidedly uneconomic, I think, as I said a moment ago, to employ any type of stigmatizing term to indicate the low-grade product which might defeat the very purpose of this measure, and prevent its sale. Senator KENDRICK. That would not do at all.

Senator FRAZIER. Has the department come to any conclusion as to how they will designate the high grade, the first grade?

Doctor CAMPBELL. Not yet, Mr. Chairman. This matter was brought up only very recently; and when the proponents of this measure, the canners themselves, indicated their intent to bring about the introduction of the measure, they came to the department and discussed it, and asked what the department's reaction was; and the department answered substantially as I have undertaken to say to you what its position on the measure would be. Since then they have not considered at all any of the standards for the various types or classes of canned-food products, or even the nature of the designation that should be employed in the event that this measure does become effective. If and when it passes, of course, the department will instantly take up that question.

Senator CAPPER. Then, Doctor Campbell, I take it that the department has a favorable reaction toward the proposed legislation? Doctor CAMPBELL. Quite so.

Senator CAPPER. Do you know of any group of consumers or any business concerns who would be directly affected by the proposed legislation who are opposing the legislation or anything in the nature of the plan embodied in the bill?

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Doctor CAMPBELL. I know of none. I have heard none. I have heard expressions that would indicate the desirability of legislation of this sort, and undoubtedly the canners themselves had, and that is probably what has inspired this attempt at this legislation. I can conceive of nobody being adversely affected by the terms of this bill except the canners themselves, and they are themselves coming in and proposing this form of legislation. They undoubtedly are sufficiently in advance of ordinary commercial operations to recognize the benefit from the establishment of these two primary grades which they will have; and since they have asked for it, I can conceive of nobody whom the measure would affect adversely or who would have any real pertinent ground upon which to object to it.

Senator FRAZIER. Will this include canned fish such as salmon? Doctor CAMPBELL. Yes.

Senator FRAZIER. It will affect fish?

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