The CHAIRMAN. The telegram will be incorporated in the record together with the statement made by Mr. Curran that there are 5,000 signers to it. Is Mr. Malone here?

Mr. MALONE. Yes, sir.

STATEMENT OF V. J. MALONE, SECRETARY, PACIFIC COAST MARINE FIREMEN, OILERS, WATER TENDERS, AND WIPERS' ASSOCIATION

The CHAIRMAN. Proceed.

Mr. MALONE. My name is V. J. Malone, Secretary of the Pacific Coast Marine Firemen, Oilers, Water Tenders and Wipers' Association. The Pacific Coast Marine Firemen, Oilers, Water Tenders and Wipers' Association is an organization of 5,000 members on the west coast and endorses this bill practically in its entirety. We believe that the preamble to the bill briefly states, and states very well what all seamen have realized for years, to wit:

Ordinarily there exists among the workers engaged in transportation on waters adjacent to the United States a volume of unemployment which lowers the efficiency and impairs the morale of such workers. The great body of workers in other branches of industry, trade, and transportation are now protected to some degree against the hazard of unemployment, maritime workers being the only group within the field of industry, trade, and transportation who are not so protected.

It is a fact that seamen believe that they are the forgotten men in this matter of unemployment insurance. We have looked around and all of the other transportation workers are adequately taken care of. The railroad workers, the truck drivers, and teamsters are taken care of, and even the longshoremen are taken care of, and the unemployment benefits just stop right at the water's edge. As far as the workers outside of the maritime industry, those in the transportation industries, are concerned, we find that those workers are very well taken care of both by the State and Federal laws. When ship loadings have been light the practice of the industry for years has been to lay off the crew, when laid up in port, and there is also injected into the picture the question of what happens to the crews when there is a shipwreck. Years ago there was the celebrated case of the President Hoover, which was wrecked in the China seas. Now, when that ship was wrecked, the pay of the crew stopped right there, and as soon as they got back to San Francisco they were on their own. The company was not interested in what happened to those men, and many other cases can be quoted along the same lines. Just as soon as the men are ashore they are through, the ship being laid up, although they are doing ship work. They are on their own resources, which are sometimes not very much.

Then, there was the case of the Admiral Wiley wreck which occurred about 18 months ago off the Australian coast. Only a strong union existing to take care of those men brought them back home and it took care of them when they got home, and enabled them to live.

Recently on this coast we lost one of our ships which was wrecked. in the Caribbean, and our unions and other unions will have to take care of those men until they ship out.

In the present emergency what happens to the crews of those ships. that are bombed and torpedoed? We see in the headlines in the

papers accounts about the Robin Moor and the Steel Seafarer being sunk, but nobody seems to bother at all about what happens to those fellows when they get back to port or how they will be taken care of. We believe that the legislation that was considered at the time the President Hoover was bombed should be enacted into law. The general public and Congress were startled to find that a seaman's wages ceases when a ship has been wrecked. Now, the crew of the Steel Seafarer, unless they have been taken care of by bonuses under normal circumstances would lose that pay.

The CHAIRMAN. What is the the number of that bill to which you referred?

Mr. MALONE. I do not know.

The CHAIRMAN. If you will let me have it I would like to look that up.

Mr. MALONE. Yes, sir; I will do that. It is a somewhat surprising situation, Mr. Chairman, because from the earliest times seamen have been regarded as wards of the Federal Government. That fact has been stressed time and time again.

Right now the employment situation is very good. We believe that now is the time to build the necessary fund to cushion the shocks that will occur when the inevitable let-down occurs later. There seems to be a tendency on the part of the operators to claim an emergency and to let the Government take care of the crews when the emergency is over. We believe that is a very short-sighted policy. It was the policy that was followed during the last war, and I think if you read the wellknown book written by Winston Churchill, The Crisis, you will find that much the same attitude was taken by the British Government with regard to their crews. Again and again Mr. Churchill handed out words of praise to the crews who, despite being torpedoed four or five times, went back into those dangerous waters again, and when the war was over those crews were the forgotten men. We believe that much the same thing will happen when this war is over to those crews unless Congress is foresighted and takes some action to provide financial stability for those men when this present emergency is over. We believe that the normal course of commerce should be considered, and the normal employment should also be considered, and that steps should be taken to preserve the earning capacity of those men and to prevent them from going to the dog house. We believe that these men now affected by the emergency shipping boom should be taken care of, because from what we can see we believe that during the next 3 years the boom will continue. It is a very short-sighted policy to say as soon as this boom is over you fellows will be thrown on the scrap heap and you will have to fend for yourselves, and that should be prevented by making provision for it now.

The CHAIRMAN. I have no hesitancy in saying that I wish the operators would evidence a spirit of sympathy in trying to work out these problems rather than always interposing the objection that it cannot be done, making that objection to everything that is suggested, but instead that they would try to come in and reach some affirmative solution of these problems.

Mr. MALONE. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. When we hear those statements made we say, "Well, there are other industries that are booming." It is obvious to everybody that the aircraft industry is

booming and that the shipbuilding industry is booming. What steps are being taken to preserve and care for the employees in those industries?

The CHAIRMAN. They are receiving unemployment compensation, are they not?

Mr. MALONE. That is the obvious answer, Mr. Chairman, and the same thing goes for the shipbuilding industry, and if those industries can do it why cannot the steamship-operating business do it.

Insofar as the dangers of the sea are concerned those things are inherent in the industry. Many operators will claim to you members of the committee that a man is liable to be hurt, and he is covered for that by the compensation laws. At the same time, we want to point out that although the new construction of ships is very good, there is also a danger there that is not generally stressed, and that is that these new ships are going out with 400 and as high as 500 pounds of steam pressure. I have been told on very good authority that it just takes one pin-point leak for the steam to escape from those boilers, and the firemen attending that boiler will be killed as dead as a dead mackerel. The same thing goes in regard to the pressure on these Diesel engines which are being used in some ships. I realize that has nothing to do with unemployment, but it is just a problem that we bring up at this time.

A very definite problem exists, and this bill as it stands is acceptable to us with a few minor amendments. We feel that on page 51, line 11, the words "or any other agency of the Federal Government or by a State, Territorial, or foreign government," should be stricken. We offer that as an amendment because of the fact that too often we have found duplicate functions of governmental departments causing jurisdictional arguments and attending complications that should not exist. If a board is to be created to operate under this bill I believe it serves no good function by calling in any other agency of the Federal Government. The Board itself should handle the whole problem and admit 100 percent its responsibility for it.

Then, there is another minor change which we would suggest. On the same page, section (j) strike out beginning with the words "notwithstanding any other provisions", to the end of the paragraph on page 52, line 8, because we believe it is not entirely necessary for any notation to be made on a man's certificate or continuous-discharge book, or any other document. We do not believe that is necessary under any of the compensation laws applied in the States, and we do not see why it should apply to the seamen. The whole thing is entirely unnecessary. That concludes my statement, Mr. Chairman.

The CHAIRMAN. Are there any further questions? If not, stand aside. Captain McHugh.

STATEMENT OF PATRICK MCHUGH, REPRESENTING THE ATLANTIC FISHERMEN'S UNION, BOSTON, MASS.

Captain MCHUGH. Mr. Chairman, and gentlemen of the committee, my name is Patrick McHugh. I represent the Atlantic Fishermen's Union, which is affiliated with the Seafarers International, A. F. of L., of Boston, Mass.

The CHAIRMAN. All right, sir.

Captain MCHUGH. I believe our status under this bill is somewhat the same as the men employed on the inland waterways, to be administered by the State. I believe that our State legislature does not meet for 2 years. Anyway, I spoke to Mr. Latimer about it, and he said. fishermen were included, the same, as for instance, those on the Great Lakes, and it would take about 2 years for them to make a study of the whole thing. Now, we think the fishermen have a special need for unemployment compensation. They are corporation employees, and as such should come under unemployment compensation. Fishermen work for wages, as do other employees who are covered by unemployment compensation. They want unemployment compensation, and they and their families need it. The fishermen should be protected by unemployment compensation for national-defense purposes.

The majority of fishermen are married men with large families to support. Part of their wages is a duplication of current expenses. Serious wage fluctuation depends on factors beyond their control, that is, market prices are subject to possible manipulation by a small group of companies which operate the fishing fleet and which, in turn, purchase the catch at the pier, with very limited competition. The fishermen have no control over their wages, as they depend upon how many boats go fishing. For instance, in 1932, during this depression, approximately half the fishing fleet was tied up, thus throwing hundreds of fishermen out of work, none of whom could obtain unemployment compensation during the period they were trying to find other employ

ment.

In 1940, the Government purchased 25 boats for national-defense purposes, at prices advantageous to the companies that owned the boats, but 300 fishermen were dumped "on the bricks," without benefit of unemployment compensation. In a true cooperative manner, those who were still employed, reduced their own wages, by sharing each seventh trip with those who had lost their jobs. In other words, we would take maybe one or two or four additional men on all of the boats and take care of those men ourselves. Now, if we had not had the union that would not have been done. Now, the Government has just taken five more boats from the companies for national-defense purposes. Nine men of each crew have been employed by the companies to man these boats, the remaining 50 are thrown out of work, without the benefit of unemployment compensation. What will become of the others or how they will make out, we do not know.

There are a lot of factors that enter into the fishing business such as, for instance, whether any fish are caught; whether any fish are caught by others; what kind of fish is caught; what market there is for the kind caught; the price obtainable, which is controlled by the employing companies, bidding in a limited competitive field; and how long the season lasts for the particular fish caught. At the present time we have 40 or 50 boats which have been fishing all summer with 14 or 15 men crews, but now because bad weather is coming they cannot go too far offshore. They must reduce the crews about 50 percent. We will have probably 150 to 200 men that won't have any work from now on except what they might be able to find somewhere. in the yards, probably.

The fishermen are employees of corporations, all of whose employees, with the exception of the fishermen, are covered by unemployment compensation.

When the fishermen cease to fish and proceed to unload fish on any other boat than the one on which they have just been fishing, they are classified as "lumpers," and immediately come under the Unemployment Compensation Act. In both cases they are working for the same employer. As fishermen they are not covered. As lumpers they are covered.

Fishermen work for companies which, although required to sell at open market, are themselves the purchasers of the fish, as well as the wholesalers of it. All employees of these companies are covered by unemployment compensation, except the fishermen, and yet, it is the fishermen who are exposed to the greater hazards and hardships and the greater fluctuation of employment. The social-security laws regard the fishermen as employees for the purposes of old-age and survivors' insurance. The fishermen are paid a wage at the termination of each trip. There is no guaranty that they will go out again.

The corporation officials and other employees work for wages in the form of salaries and bonuses. There is no difference fundamentally between their wages and the fisherman's wages except that they-the fishermen are paid off each trip.

When the fishermen unload fish on boats other than the one on which they have just been on a fishing trip, they are classified as "lumpers," and they are paid a wage. This wage entitles them to the benefits of unemployment compensation. However, as the amount thus earned by fishermen is negligible, they seldom qualify for even the minimum benefits.

Fishing is an extremely hazardous occupation. The fishermen want to feel that their families can be adequately taken care of during times of economic stress, at least as well as the average shore workers can care for their families.

The fishermen want their children to have the educational opportunities they have missed, and have the further assurance that during times of unemployment, seasonal or otherwise, their children's education will not be interrupted.

The fishermen want to be assured that their families can have protection under the Unemployment Compensation Act, as they have been known to work for 19 or 20 trips and not earn more than sufficient to cover fishing expenses and not have any wage to take home to their families; whereas the man on shore who works always receives a wage. Still, because they have a job the State cannot help them, and it is a little harder on them than anyone else. We would like very much to have them put under this social security, because we have had so many men unemployed in the last year. So, we think they should be covered the same as seamen.

The CHAIRMAN. Are there any questions? Stand aside, Captain. (The following statement was subsequently filed for the record.)

The Atlantic Fishermen's Union asks that unemployment-compensation protection be extended to fishermen on the same basis as to other working people.

Fishermen are obliged to work under laborious and hazardous conditions to tring in the fish, which supplies a valuable element in the diet of working people and furnishes raw materials for industrial processing.

The average fisherman has a wife and large family to support, from whom he must be absent for frequent extended periods.

They work in an industry which forms an important element in national de fense, for which already many of the larger trawlers have been taken. When the Navy needed to build up their auxiliary fleet, they took 25 boats from Boston