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Organization of the Surplus Property BoardContinued

Office Supplies Division-Continued.

Administrative assistant.-
Secretaries, 2 at $2,300.--
Clerk-stenographers, 2 at $2,000.-

$3, 200 4, 600 4, 000

Total, 9..

39, 300

Deputy Administrator...
Assistant Deputy Administrator.
Administrative assistant.-


9, 000 6, 500 3, 200 2, 600 2, 300 2, 000

25, 600

8,000 6, 500 18, 400 3, 200 2, 300 4, 000

42, 400

8, 000 19, 500 5, 600 9, 200 3, 200 2, 600 4, 600 4, 000 3, 600

Total, 6.----
Compliance Division:

Assistant Director..
Investigators, 4 at $4,600..
Administrative assistant..
Principal clerk...
Clerk-stenographers, 2 at $2,000.

Total, 10.
Agencies Division:

Assistant Directors, 3 at $6,500.
Administrative analyst ---
Administrative analysts, 2 at $4,600
Administrative analyst...

Do ----
Secretaries, 2 at $2,300.
Clerk-stenographers, 2 at $2,000.
Clerk-typists, 2 at $1,800..

Total, 15.----
Administrative Division:

Assistant Director.
Personnel officer..
Chief Clerk
Administrative analyst-
Budget assistant
Supply officer.
Administrative assistant-

Chief file clerk
Chief mail clerk
Clerk-stenographers, 3 at $2,000
Supply clerk
File clerks, 2 at $1,800.
File clerk.
Clerk-typists, 2 at $1,620.
Chief messenger.
Messengers, 3 at $1,320

Total, 24.


60, 300

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8, 000 6, 500 5, 600 3, 800 3, 800 3, 800 3, 200 3, 200 2, 600 2,000 2, 000 6, 000 2, 000 3, 600 1, 620 3, 240 1, 560 3, 960

66, 480

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Mr. Taber. Why do you need so many people for these set-ups that you have given us? They seem to be set up on the basis of about an average of a little over $4,000 for all of them, with the exception of that administrative division, and that is about three, and it seems like they were set up at a pretty liberal figure.

Mr. WIGGLESWORTH. The average is well over $4,000, according to the table.

Mr. Taber. Yes; it is.

Colonel HOWSE. I think the answer I might give there, Mr. Taber, is, this is a top policy board; it is going to handle, I do not know how much property, but it is estimated all the way from $50,000,000,000 to $100,000,000,000 worth of property all over the world. It is a problem, which I think even the most optimistic person considers as not a simple one.

Mr. Taber. What it is going to do is to check up on the handling by these agencies rather than doing the work itself, is it not?

Colonel Howse. Not entirely; no. First of all we have to determine a policy under which they will operate. For instance, in the case of the veterans' regulations that we were discussing this morning. we have to determine a policy to tell them what to do for the veterans and how they are to do it. Then we will have to ascertain, by checking up, whether or not they are doing it.

Mr. TABER. Of course, it is largely a matter of setting up a policy with reference to what you will do with these airplanes that are declared surplus. They are under the jurisdiction of the Reconstruction Finance Corporation. Then there is the item of "Capital and producer goods." Those are the two big items of inventory and possibly the two items that will be declared surplus in the long run and the amount of items that will show the biggest loss in dollars, anyway.

Now the small things, the things that are in the small items and the ones that will run into smaller figures, like consumer goods, foods. farm surpluses, and the housing which will probably be a small item for a while at least in the amount realized—it is simply going to be s matter of following up to see that they get rid of them rather than establishing a big policy item.

Colonel Howse. Items that would have to be sold.

Mr. Taber. Your policy items, on the first two items on your inventory on page 11' are going to be items for which the Reconstruction Finance Corporation will very largely have to determine a policy, and I do not know how you are going to handle it any other way unless you duplicate entirely the set-up they have.

Colonel Howse. I might say categorically it is not contemplated that we will duplicate any of the set-ups in any of the disposal agencies. We are requiring or expecting the disposal agencies to furnish us with all of the services that they can that will assist us in determining a particular policy. We are keeping the experts as much as possible down on the level of the disposal agencies.

We have here, and are prepared to show you, certain visual charts which might indicate to you the complexity of the problem. No one single policy can be established for the disposal of airplanes. There has to be a policy worked out for the different categories of aircraft and aircraft material, and there has to be a continuing policy developed.

Mr. TABER. Perhaps we ought to have that picture before we get into this one, as to what your set-up will be. Do we have the cart before the horse? You know better than I whether or not we have the cart before the horse in our approach to this problem. Should we approach it by getting the disposal agency's picture before we get yours?

Colonel Howse. I think that is entirely up to the committee.

Mr. TABER. I want to know, because I do not want to spend a lot of time asking you questions that are going to draw out this whole procedure.

I can see this: If the problem of personnel to determine all of this policy question and that sort of thing is going to be in your board, that is one picture. On the other hand, if you are going to have a lot of these high-priced people in the disposal agencies who are going to operate on it in addition, that is going to present another problem. I would like to see what the picture is.

Perhaps going into these things, especially on the compliance and policy end of it, is going to involve another question. What about that?

Colonel Howse. I rather think, Mr. Taber, if I may be permitted an expression of personal opinion, you have to sift through the whole thing before you can come to any conclusion as to any particular parts of it. That is the way that my mind works.

May I take up the component divisions of the Board individually so we do not get them confused?

Mr. Taber. Yes; take up each one of them and tell us about them; how many you have now; why you need them; what you intend to have them do. I think we ought to cover that picture.

PERSONNEL AND WORK OF THE OFFICE OF THE ADMINISTRATOR Colonel Howse. If I may start with the Office of the Administrator: There is a provision for a total of nine, including the Administrator and two assistant administrators.

Mr. WIGGLESWORTH. That is administrative?
Mr. TABER. There is no deputy?
Colonel Howse. No.

Mr. TABER. But an assistant?

Colonel HowsE. There is one administrator and two assistant administrators, and the various administrative clerical and steno graphic people that are ordinarily essential. I think that is broken down, if I might suggest, on this chart.

Mr. TABER. That is shown in your so-called chart, or whatever

you call it?

Colonel Howse. Yes, Mr. TABER. It is quite hard to follow, a good deal more difficult to follow than a table.

NUMBER AND FUNCTIONS OF DEPUTY ADMINISTRATORS Colonel HOWSE. There are established seven deputy administrators, cach in charge of

Mr. TABER (interposing). Are they presently functioning, or are they just in sight?

Čolonel Howse. Four of them are presently functioning and three, I hope, are en route here and are to be here by the end of the week.

Each deputy then has jurisdiction over the principal category or industry as they are laid out on that chart.

Mr. T ABER. How are they laid out in this table; as indicated here, I assume?

Colonel HOWSE. Yes; that is correct.


Mr. TABER. The first one seems to be a staff office on the table, for staff service. Is he functioning?

Colonel Howse. He is not; no.

Mr. TABER. There seems to be on the chart 6 cmployees calling for $25,000 and on the table there seems to be 55 at $194,000. Those two do not seem to go together.

Colonel Howse. The chart shows the total figure, Mr. Taber.
Mr. TABER. Covers all of that under him?
Colonel Howse. Everything under him.

Mr. TABER. That seems to be $194,000. That covers the whole set-up?

Colonel Howse. Yes.
Mr. Taber. That is the administrative set-up?
Colonel Howse. No; that is not quite correct, Mr. Taber.
Mr. TABER. What is it?

Colonel Howse. The administrative set-up, which is the overhead operations of the Board, the housekeeping functions of the Administrative Division.

Mr. TABER. That is the $66,000?
Colonel Howse. That is correct, and 24 employees.
Mr. TABER. What about the first one?
Colonel Howse. The Compliance Division?
Mr. TABER. No; the one on top, right above that.
Mr. CANNON. The staff services?

Mr. Taber. For six employees, and $25,000; that is their job too, is it not?

Colonel Howse. No. Their job, Mr. Taber, is to supervise the handling of the entire staff services, and supervision of the three

divisions under them. The staff service set-up is broken down into three distinct operations: One is the compliance set-up, which establishes the policy for the compliance activities of owning and disposal agencies.

STAFF AND WORK OF COMPLIANCE DIVISION Mr. TABER. You are asking for a director and an assistant director and four investigators with salaries above $4,000 in the compliance set-up. What would be the job of this Compliance Division?

Colonel Howse. The Compliance Division, Mr. Taber. would establish the policies under which the disposal agencies--and that includes all of them--would operate insofar as building their own investigative units is concerned. Perhaps I am not competent to mention here either the necessity or the lack of necessity for having strong investigative units down through the disposal agencies. Certainly the history of the last war indicated that it was very desirable, and even then scandals occurred. The possibilities of manupulation in the sale of $100,000,000,000 of surplus, of course, are enormous. We are asking each disposal agency to set up their own compliance groups so as to police their own operations. We have the over-all group at the board level for the purpose of establishing the policies under which they will operate.

We have four investigators for the country at large in cases of problems of national proportion, or the problems that are certain to arise between agencies where one agency has no jurisdiction over the other. We are making no effort to duplicate any of the criminal functions presently followed by the F. B. I., the Treasury, Secret Service, and so on.

Arrangements are being made under this set-up to refer criminal cases to them for handling.

Mr. Taber. In other words, you are going to have an investigatorial service and a compliance section in each disposal agency to police itself, and then you are to have this section as an over-all picture to police the agencies.

Colonel Howse. That is correct; yes.
Mr. TABER. That is the objective of this picture?
Colonel Howse. I think that would be a very fair statement.


Mr. Taber. Now this next section, the Agencies Division. You have there quite a considerable set-up.

You have a director in the Agencies Division and three assistant directors at $6,500, and an administrative analyst at $5,600, and a couple of administrative analysts at $4,600. Then there are some more at lower figures. You have secretaries, and so forth, totaling $60,300. What do these people have to do?

Colonel Howse. That is the group, Mr. Taber, that will be conrerned with inquiring into the procedures and operations of the various disposal agencies; for approving the disbursement to the disposal agencies of the reimbursable funds from the $60,000,000 fund that we are presently seeking.

Mr. TABER. I thought that was what the deputy administrator of the staff was supposed to do.

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