to Ohio for reclaiming and further use, and it was not considered economically feasible to do that. So, it was a surplus because of its location and not considered as strategically important because of that.

I could tell you a rather amusing incident. I can tell you, because the Secretary of Commerce has told it to other groups since. He called me up one day right after having arrived from Ohio. He, I am sure, as he said, had full intentions of giving me a going over for allowing all these rubber tires to go out of the country, because there was a picture in one of his papers at home, that is, one of the Ohio papers, of tires on the dock waiting for loading. That was the caption at the top. In the fine print, however, it said, "These tires are waiting to be cut into scrap under the supervision of the Collector of Customs before leaving the country."

Mr. BATTLE. There were not any footnotes on some of the comments that I heard over the air.

Mr. MACY. I am sure that is right. Let me take one other case as a case in point.

Mr. BURLESON. Let me interrupt you. Is this what the radio commentators and columnists are talking about, or were recently?

Mr. MACY. That is correct. Let me give you another example, and I am very much interested in your proposal on public relations. We frankly have been, quote, sitting ducks, unquote.

Mr. BATTLE. So are we.

U.S. COPPER SHIPMENT TO CHINA IN 1950

Mr. MACY. Take the copper story. It appeared over the radio through Fulton Lewis, I believe in September or thereabouts. Senator O'Conor brought it out in his hearings when Fulton Lewis broadcast it over the radio.

The story appeared to imply, and was repeated over and over again even after we put out a press release on it, that the copper was still going out. Actually this copper was shipped from Japan. There was a total of about 4 million pounds-and if I get my figures wrong in any part of this story, Mr. Ostroff, I would like you to correct me-but 4 million pounds were shipped from Japan, destined for the United States in January and February of 1950. The dates are very important, as it is that far back. That material arrived in New York and was not unloaded, but sold and loaded on board other ships destined for China. Immediately it was taken to China. It did not come into what was at that time our regulations so that we could control it. It did not come under the jurisdiction of the Collector of Customs, under our control. We found out about it late in February and early in March, and immediately made arrangements with SCAP-Supreme Commander Allied Powers-officials in Japan so that this could not happen again. We made arrangements with them and we put into effect after that a regulation to cover any such articles from Japan that touched our ports, whether it came in to the United States or not. If it was in bond, in a free port or touched our shores, it came within our control, and its on-forwarding could be regulated.

As I said, that story was being told on the basis of copper still going from the United States to China. It never did. It went from Japan to the shores of the United States and out again without getting caught.

Mr. BATTLE. That couldn't happen now under present regulations? Mr. MACY. That is correct.

FACT AND FICTION OF TRADE ABUSE

Mr. CHIPERFIELD. May I say this, Mr. Chairman. You will recall that Mr. Vorys told some of the officials from the State Department about what Mr. Stettinius did when he was head of lend lease. He had prepared for the committee what he called fact and fiction. He followed up every rumor or every story, and then he would tell what actually happened. If it did happen, he assured us that it would not happen again, and so on. I do not know whether that is feasible here. Mr. OSTROFF. As a matter of fact, we have such a paper on the O'Conor investigation. We send it on request. As Mr. Macy said, maybe we have not been "sitting ducks" but "sleeping ducks" to some extent. But we do have that information.

We do not want to give the impression that everything Senator O'Conor discovered is not true, because that is not so. Some of the things were true. I think the problem comes when you describe something in 4 million pounds when ordinarily the commodity is described by tons. There was a little tendency to exaggerate-when you say about how many pounds instead of tons or whatever the regular unit is. Streptomycin should be described by value and not by number of Oxford units, since there are 140,000 units per each treatment.

Mr. MACY. That same flurry included petroleum as you probably remember. The petroleum products that were being talked about were petroleum petrolatum and petroleum jelly. In your language and my language that is vasoline and white oil, but it was referred to as petroleum. We had the other important petroleum products under control.

I went up to New York because of several shipments of petroleum jelly and white oil that were apparently being loaded up there. Due to the fact that there were fairly excessive shipments, we thought we ought to do something about it. So within 20 minutes, Mr. Ostroff, we had that under control when we saw that it was building up a head of steam. That is the way we have been operating. We have been so busy operating, as you say, we have not taken care of our public relations as we should have.

Mr. BATTLE. Would you furnish for our record also this "Fact and Fiction" presentation?

Mr. OSTROFF. Yes, sir. It really was not a case of error or misrepresentation on the part of Senator O'Conor, but just a case of his not having all the facts about some of these matters.

Mr. BURLESON. I definitely would like to have a copy.

Mr. OSTROFF. We will make sure that you get it.

Mr. BATTLE. Is it a thick publication?

Mr. OSTROFF. No, sir, about four pages.

Mr. BATTLE. Is it something that can be expanded?

Mr. OSTROFF. I think after you take a look at it you can tell us whether there is enough there for your purposes.

Mr. MACY. We will be glad to get anything together that you like. We are happy to have anybody take an interest in this.

Mr. BATTLE. We deeply appreciate your appearance, gentlemen. If you will furnish for the record the things which we have asked for, we will appreciate it.

The committee is adjourned, subject to the call of the chairman. [Thereupon, at 12:30 p.m., the committee adjourned, subject to the call of the Chair.]

MUTUAL DEFENSE ASSISTANCE CONTROL ACT OF

1951 (BATTLE ACT)

(H.R. 1621, H.R. 1939, and H.R. 4550, 82d Cong., 1st Sess.)

THURSDAY, MARCH 15, 1951

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,

COMMITTEE ON FOREIGN AFFAIRS,

SUBCOMMITTEE ON H.R. 1621 AND H.R. 1939,*

Washington, D.C.

The special Subcommittee on H.R. 1621 and H.R. 1939 met in executive session at 10:30 a.m. in the Foreign Affairs Committee room, G-3 in the Capitol, Hon. Laurie C. Battie (chairman of the subcommittee) presiding.

Mr. BATTLE. The subcommittee will be in order. We are privileged today to have with us Mr. Hickerson, who is the Assistant Secretary of State for United Nations Affairs.

PURPOSE OF HEARING

As you know, Mr. Hickerson, this subcommittee has under consideration H.R. 1621 and H.R. 1939. They have as a general theme the stopping of shipments and reshipments of and the placing of an embargo on war materials going behind the Iron Curtain.

The question has come up during these hearings about the United Nations taking action in stopping shipments. That is the reason we have asked you to come down here and give us some information, whatever you care to give and whatever develops in the hearing relative to the possibility of that organization acting on this particular question.

Everybody here, of course, understands that this is an executive session. What you say is off the record. One of the things, of course, which has prompted these hearings is the publicity in magazines, newspapers, and so forth about the supplying of Red China with materials that will build her war machine while at the same time we send our boys over there to get killed..

In the U.S. News & World Report of January 12, 1951, there is at big headline, "Big Business for Gun Runners." It states:

Chinese Communists, buying up, war goods, find good shopping in the West. War cargoes move through a dozen ports. Steel, oil, even guns, are being landed in China almost daily. Chinese traders are busy making deals everywhere they can. Partial blockade, loose controls, are pinching some. But they aren't tight enough to cut the Communist trade lanes.

The people and the Congress are very anxious to have a better understanding about the whole program. We at this particular time are

*See footnote 1, p. 7, for list of subcommittee members.

anxious to get an understanding of this problem as it relates to your department. If you will give us a little background at this time perhaps we can ask questions.

STATEMENT OF HON. JOHN D. HICKERSON, ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF STATE FOR UNITED NATIONS AFFAIRS

Mr. HICKERSON. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I will be glad to do so. The bulk of what I say this morning is information that is not strictly confidential. It is of considerable comfort to me to know that this is an executive session, that we are off the record, because when I get into a discussion of what the United Nations is doing, their work in regard to possible embargoes against Communist China, that is confidential. I repeat, it will be a comfort to me to be able to speak perfectly frankly to friends, even though the bulk of what I tell you is not strictly confidential.

I will talk almost wholly about the United Nations and what it could do in this particular field. My understanding is that you have had other witnesses from the Department. Of course, the committee is entitled to all the Department is able to give you in regard to the actual text of the business.

I believe, moreover, one or more of my colleagues has talked to you in executive session about embargoes that are now being imposed by countries receiving assistance from the United States. This is not only in the Iron Curtain countries, but also in regard to Communist China. I assume you have had information about that.

Mr. BATTLE. Information about controls of materials going from other countries has been very scanty. We have talked about it very generally. Most of the information to date has come from what we are doing in this country to stop the shipments.

Mr. HICKERSON. The reason I mention that is I am not in a position to talk about that. It is not my field.

Mr. BATTLE. We will get that information from other sources.

ROLE OF SECURITY COUNSEL IN ECONOMIC SANCTIONS

Mr. HICKERSON. The United Nations is not in a position to impose embargoes or take economic sanctions against a country. As a matter of right and by order it cannot call upon them to do things unless the action is taken by the Security Council. This action would be taken under article 41 of the charter. You will recall there are actions that could be taken thereunder by the Security Council. When the Security Council takes this action, it is an order; it is binding on all the members.

It starts with article 39 about the determination of a threat to the peace. Then article 40 goes on to say:

In order to prevent an aggravation of the situation, the Security Council may, before making the recommendations or deciding upon the measures provided for in Article 39, call upon the parties concerned to comply with such provisional measures as it deems necessary or desirable. Such provisional measures shall be without prejudice to the rights, claims, or position of the parties concerned.