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Mr. NEDZI. Have you ever seen her?
The WITNESS. No, sir; I have never seen her.
Mr. NEDZI. When was she with the committee, to your knowledge?

The WITNESS. I don't know, because it was before I was on the staff of the committee so I don't-I don't know the dates.

Mr. NEDZI. In all the time that you were working with the Congressman, was she performing any kind of service?

The WITNESS. I don't know how often this happened, but I have, on some three or four different occasions, mailed to her letters that came in from Puerto Rican or Spanish-speaking constituents, because I did the casework, and we have mailed that to her for translation in some instances. If the New York-Puerto Rican constituent was asking about something that you would refer to some official in Puerto Rico, we generally would go through Mrs. Powell to get to whatever person it was. I didn't have—I don't have any idea of how many times I did that. I didn't do it daily or even weekly, but I have on some different occasions.

As a matter of fact, there were many, many times, really, in sorting the mail that he would have one of the secretaries, usually it was Mr. Berens during the time that I was there, come in and go through the mail

Mr. NEDZI. Would you fix the time period you are talking about now; when was this?

The WITNESS. This was during the entire time that I was in his office. Mr. NEDZI. This was in 1965?

The WITNESS. Yes; during any part of the period it would have happened, A stack of mail so high, there would usually be some, at least three or four pieces, several pieces that he would direct to Mrs. Powell. He would go through the mail and just look at it and say, "Send this to Dargans, send this to this person, send this to that one." That is how he went. Mr. NEDZI. Have you any idea what the content of that mail was?

The WITNESS. Not now. Varied and sundry. I was aware only of that that had to do with the casework, because that is what I worked on. I wouldn't be able to say just exactly what it was. Mr. NEDZI. Various and sundry” has no

The WITNESS. "Various and sundry" meant it could be about anything, meaning that I don't really—I couldn't say what the content was.

Mr. NEDZI. Were any responses received from her and communicated to the office to your knowledge?

The WITNESS. Yes. Such papers, insofar as the casework was concerned, and I just imagine with the others, but I know that I did receive back some replies on the casework. Mr. NEDZI. What was the nature of the reply, to your memory?

The WITNESS. Well, in handling casework, you know, we just would send out a copy of the inquiry to whoever would be the person to give us some type of answer. It if was a matter of translating it, you would get a translation back. If it had been a matter of bucking it to some person, you would get it back, just as you do when you send a request to one of the departments here, that you would get the constituent's letter back and a copy of the reply from him.

Mr. NEDZI. Now, in all these cases, Mrs. Powell would be in Puerto

The WITNESS. At any time that I sent it she was in Puerto Rico.
Mr. NEDZI. Did you ever send her mail anyplace else?
The WITNESS. I have never sent her mail other than Puerto Rico.
Mr. NEDZI. I have no further questions, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. Hays. Mrs. Harris, allegation has been made that this committee is making scapegoats out of the staff. Do you feel that you have been made a scapegoat in any way by this committee?

The WITNESS. By your committee?
Mr. Hays. Yes, ma'am.

The WITNESS. No, sir, I don't. And I do appreciate really the consideration you gave me yesterday in allowing me to not sit here and to go back to the office. I didn't feel that I was a scapegoat.

Mr. Hays. Do you feel maybe you might have been made a scapegoat in some way or other by having your name used without your knowledge?

The WITNESS. Yes, I do. I don't like it. At this point I don't see that there is anything I can do except personally not like it.

Mr. Hays. I think that is fair enough. Certainly there is no imputation against you or any indication of any wrongdoing on your part. It appears that your name was used without your knowledge and you have so testified, isn't that right?

The WITNESS. Right, sir.
Mr. Hays. Any other questions?
[No response.]

Mr. Hays. Thank you very much, Mrs. Harris. You are discharged from the subpena.

The WITNESS. Thank you. Mr. Hays. I want to say off the record(Discussion off the record.) Mr. O'CONNOR. Mr. Anderson. (Witness excused.) Mr. Hays. Mr. Anderson, will you state your full name and address for the record.

Mr. ANDERSON. Donald Louis Anderson, 709-A Delaware Avenue SW., Washington.

Mr. Hays. Will you stand and raise your right hand.

DONALD L. ANDERSON, having been duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows:

By Mr. O'CONNOR: Q. Mr. Anderson, you are employed on the staff of Representative Powell?

A. No. I am technically on a leave of absence with the Citizens Crusade Against Poverty, and have been since April 1.

Q. April 1 of 1966?
A. Yes.

Q. Were you at one time employed on the staff of Congressman Powell?

A. Yes, I was the previous 2 years, approximately 2 years and 1 month.

Mr. Hays. Just a moment. Off the record.
(Discussion off the record.)
Mr. Hays. You may proceed.

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By Mr. O'CONNOR:

When were you employed on Representative Powell's staff? A. Approximately March 5, I believe, 1964.

Until when?
A. April 1, 1966.
Q. And what was your position on the staff?

A. I held several nominal positions, first as assistant counsel, then as counsel, then as—they called me general counsel for the Ad Hoc Subcommittee on Poverty, beginning on about August or September of 1964–1965.

Q. Let's
A. And education counsel sometime between that period.

Q. All right. All of our questions will be related to the period January 3, 1965, until the time you departed from the committee, during the 89th Congress.

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Now, in connection with your duties was it necessary for you to perform official travel?

A. Yes, it was.

Q. And to what degree and to what extent would you perform this travel?

A. I traveled extensively between January 3 and the time I left, all over the country, out West several times. And I was made responsible for conducting the investigations in poverty before we received the appropriation to do so. As a matter of fact, in September of 1964, the chairman told me to birddog poverty and, of course, I did.

Q. In connection with your travels for the committee did you submit vouchers for subsistence and out-of-pocket expenses?

A. Yes, I did.
Q. Did you do that on all occasions of your travel?

A. Well, I was mystified by your—the allegations in the audit, because it would have been an extraordinary oversight for me not to submit a voucher for travel.

Q. The audit developed that you made six trips to New York City during this period in which you claimed subsistence, and then there were six trips to New York City in which you claimed no subsistence.

A. I made considerably more than six trips during that period. I never remember not having claimed subsistence for trips to New York.

Q. Could you say for the record that on each of the trips which you took on official business that you submitted a voucher for subsistence?

A. I will say that as a matter of habit, and I don't want to get myself in that box yet because I may not-I will say as a matter of habit it would have been an oversight for me not to have claimed subsistence.

Q. But it was your practice?
A. It was my practice.
Q. Whenever you took a trip you submitted à voucher?
A. As far as I can remember, to claim subsistence.

And if you have the vouchers for those trips, I would like to see them. I would recognize my own signature.

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Q. I have a voucher here which is voucher No. 7206, in which you incurred expenses while on a field trip for the ad hoc subcommittee, the Far West task force.

A. I made that trip with Congressman Hawkins and Congresswoman Mink.

Q. And where was that trip to?
A. It was to, as I recall, in March of 1965–
Q. March 27 to April 1, 1965?
A. Yes. As I recall—may I see the voucher?
Q. Yes. If you will mark that “Anderson exhibit 1."

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Carmen, Cummitus on Flowe Administratius Paid by check No. United States at Washington, D. C., in favor of payee named above

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(The above referred to document was marked "Anderson exhibit 1" and received in evidence.)

The WITNESS. Yes; this is my signature. Those trips were to Oregon, and I am doing it from memory. I haven't-my records, unfortunately, are not as complete as they should be. But as I recall, the trips were to Oregon, to San Francisco, to Los Angeles, to Sacramento."

By Mr. O'CONNOR: That voucher indicates that you were not in Washington, D.C., on March 28, 1965, is that correct?

A. Yes; it does.

Q. And would you so testify that you were not in Washington, D.Č., on March 28, 1965?

A. Well, I know what you are trying to say, that during the same period –

Q. Well, I will be very frank with you. There is an airline ticket with your name on it, on the New York shuttle, Washington, D.C., to New York.

A. Could I see the voucher for that? Q. Yes; we will show that to you. Yes. May we have Dargans No. 3, I think it is. I believe that is the exhibit.

Mr. TAYLER. No; it isn't No. 3.

Mr. Hays. It is those four tickets that were issued on that Sunday. I don't know what number it is, but we are referring to Dargans exhibits, anyway.

By Mr. O'CONNOR: Q. You might examine this voucher at the same time. No; just to look at it.

A. Well, this also is my signature.

Q. On the record, Mr. Anderson, I show you Dargans exhibit No. 2, which is an in-shuttle flight ticket, New York to Washington, to New York, either way, dated March 28, 1965, and ask if that is your signature on the ticket.

A. No. Which one would be mine?
Mr. Hays. Up in the upper left-hand corner.
The WITNESS. No; that is not my signature."

By Mr. O'CONNOR:
Q. Isn't that "Donald Anderson”?

A. Yes, that is; but that is not my signature. As you will see, my a's are almost like s’s.

Q. Do you have any knowledge as to who would sign your name to a ticket such as that?

A. No; I don't.

Q. Were you aware that your name was being signed to various travel tickets?

A. I was not; no.

Q. Have you ever heard that your name was being used in connection with travels?

A. No.

Q. I now show you voucher—let me see the voucher number on that, please voucher No. 7681, in the amount of $355.32, and ask you if you can recall the purpose of that voucher?

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