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A. That is correct, sir.

Q. Did you ever reimburse the Government for any part of that ticket?

A. No, I never did.

Q. The audit conducted by this committee of the airline records and of the travel by the House Education and Labor Committee indicates that the return portion of that ticket was never used and never turned in for refund. Can you account for that, Mr. Vidal?

A. Well, I think I might have used that other portion of the ticket through some other airline because I was not traveling by Eastern only. I was traveling Eastern, Pan American, and Trans-Caribbean. I used any line.

Q. If you used it, Mr. Vidal, did you use it during the month of April 1965, while you were employed by the committee?

A. I cannot recall if I used that portion of the ticket in those same months, but it may be so.

Q. Did you use the return portion of that ticket at any time on committee business when you were traveling on committee business?

A. Well, I was traveling just to make myself available in Washington, to move in here.

Q. Did you make any travel at all while you were on the payroll of the Education and Labor Committee, on committee business?

A. On the months of April-
Q. Do you understand what I mean by "committee business”?
A. Official business of the committee.
Q. Yes.
Ă. No, not traveling outside from Washington.
Q. No official travel while you were on the payroll?

A. No official travel. I came to Washington in those days several times and I used to stay at the Congressional Hotel because I was trying hard to move into Washington because otherwise I was told that I couldn't stay in the committee if I don't move into Washington.

Mr. Hays. Did I understand counsel to say there is no evidence that the other half of that ticket has ever been used?

Mr. TAYLER. That is right, yes.

Mr. Hays. If it hasn't been used, then obviously it would follow he didn't use it, wouldn't it?

Mr. TAYLER. He said that he probably did.

Mr. Hays. I don't care what he says. I think the witness is trying to be honest but if he used it it would show up because the airlines don't throw those things in the wastebasket.

Is it possible, Mr. Vidal, that that unused portion is lying around somewhere where it could be turned in for a refund to the committee? Do you think that is possible?

The WITNESS. I don't really recall, but to the best of my knowledge I might have used this portion of that ticket in some other airline.

Mr. Hays. I understood you to say that, but the point I am trying to make is, if you had used it, it would show up, but it doesn't show up.

The WITNESS. In no airline whatsoever? Mr. Hays. No, in no airline whatsoever. My point is, maybe it is lying around some place and somebody forgot about it.

The WITNESS. Maybe I have it some place.
Mr. Hays. You just don't remember?

The WITNESS. I don't remember. Mr. Hays. It might be well for you to check your records and if you have it, mail it up here and we will turn it in. It is a valuable piece of paper if it hasn't been used.

The WITNESS. That is right, sir. I was so sure that I have used the whole ticket. Now that there is no record on any airline, I can't answer. It is 2 years back. I might have it some place, but if I do find it in my papers or any place in Puerto Rico, I will send it to the committee. Mr. Hays. Off the record. (Discussion off the record.) Mr. Hays. On the record. Mr. TAYLER. I have no further questions.

By Mr. O'CONNOR: Q. As I understand it, you went down on March 5 to arrange with your family to bring them to Washington; is that correct?

A. On the month of March, yes, sir.

Q. That airline ticket is March 5 so that would be the day you went down; is it not?

A. Yes. Maybe so.
Q. Now, did you in fact bring your family to Washington?
A. No. No.
Q. Did you stay down in Puerto Rico after that?
A. I came several times again.
Q. You went back to New York several times?
A. To New York several times.
Q. After April 1 did you perform any services for the committee?
A. No, sir. I was fired from the committee.
Q. When were you fired?

A. After that month—I don't recall exactly. It was a letter from Congressman Powell.

Mr. Hays. Just a minute, Mr. Counsel. Maybe we better back up because I don't think he understood. The question was: After April 1-or, in other words, during the month of April—did you perform any services for the committee?

The WITNESS. No services, but I was coming into the committee office from New York.

By Mr. O'CONNOR: Q. Were you doing something for the committee when you were on the payroll during the month of April?

A. I was coming into the committee office of Washington trying to arrange for my wife to come to Washington and in those days, since I was living in New York, I was coming into the Washington office two or three times every week in the month of April. Not rendering services to the committee, just hanging around to see if we can work out something to bring my family into Washington.

Q. You received some money during the month of April? You received a paycheck?

A. I think so. I received a check for that month.
Q. That 1 month?
A. Only 1 month as far as I can recall it.
Mr. O'CONNOR. Do you have the amount of that check?
Mr. TAYLER. Yes. $563.01 net.

becor, in other whe committee but I was

By Mr. O'CONNOR:
Q. Did you do any work for the committee to earn that $560?

À. I was not assigned a particular job to do. I was in the office most of the time trying to get set.

Q. In the office here in Washington?
A. In the office here in Washington.
Q. Did you report to the office every day?
A. Not every day. Two or three times every week.
Q. Who did you report to?
A. I would report to Mr. Powell's office.

Q. Who in Mr. Powell's office? What staff member, or what employee?

X. Well, I was in his office there most of the time he was there. Chuck Stone was there.

Q. Do you remember any other names in the office?

A. There was a boy by the name of Warren, and two or three girls, like secretaries or clerks in the office.

Q. But you were right in Mr. Powell's personal office?

A. Not in his personal office. In the committee office. Sometimes I was there with Mr. Odell Clark, who used to be my boss in New York.

Q. You would come down from New York and go back to New York after a couple of days?

A. That is right.
Q. That was done on airline travel tickets?
A. Yes.
Q. Who would give you these tickets?

A. That was done on my own. I was never paid for those trips. Only one trip.

Mr. TAYLER. There is no travel shown for him in April.

Mr. O'CONNOR. I understand that. I don't understand the witness' testimony that he performs no services, yet he is in the office and receives $560 for apparently nothing and then he

By Mr. O'CONNOR:
Q. Let's take it from the time that you went down to arrange with
your family to come up to Washington. How long did you stay in
Puerto Rico at that time on that trip?

A. About 4 or 5 days.
Q. You then went back to New York?
A. Yes.

Q. You were back in New York during the month of March, shortly after you went down?,

A. Yes.
Q. Do you know who gave you the ticket to go to Puerto Rico?
A. Yes, Congressman Powell authorized that ticket.

Q. I know he authorized it. Who did you receive it from, do you know?

A. I think it was Miss Dargans.

Q. Did you get that ticket in Washington or New York, do you know?

A. I got this ticket in here in Washington, in the offices.
Mr. O'CONNOR. I don't think I have any further questions.

Mr. DICKINSON. Tell me your last name, please. The WITNESS. Vidal. V-i-d-a-l. Mr. DICKINSON. Alfredo Vidal? The WITNESS. That is correct. Mr. DICKINSON. I have no questions. Mr. Hays. Mr. Nedzi? Mr. NEDZI. Mr. Vidal, did you do any work in New York for the committee during this period of March and April 1965?

The WITNESS. No. Mr. NEDZI. Why were you going back and forth to New York so frequently?

The WITNESS. I had some political activities going on with the Puerto Rican leaders there.

Mr. DEVINE. Mr. Vidal, you indicated in your testimony earlier that this air travel from New York to Washington and return and the trip to San Juan was on the basis that you did not have any money and you weren't able to afford

The WITNESS. Right, sir. Mr. DEVINE. Yet you say you traveled between San Juan and New York two or three times during that month?

The WITNESS. Yes. Mr. DEVINE. You figure you did use that portion of the ticket, the return portion?

The WITNESS. I think I used it, but I couldn't recall exactly. Mr. DEVINE. You said you made a couple more trips from San Juan to New York. Who paid for those?

The WITNESS. I have a political committee in Puerto Rico and New York and sometimes they paid for these trips when they were political trips.

Mr. DEVINE. You think during the month of March those were paid for through that source?

The WITNESS. I think so, sir. Mr. DEVINE. And you think you used the other portion of this ticket on those occasions?

The WITNESS. I don't know. Mr. TAYLER. Mr. Chairman, may the two tickets be admitted into the record at the appropriate place as Vidal exhibits 1 and 2? Mr. Hays. Without objection.

(The documents previously marked “Vidal exhibits 1 and 2 were received in evidence.)

By Mr. TAYLER: Q. Do you know Mrs. Adam Clayton Powell, whose maiden name is Flores?

A. Yes; I know her.
Q. How long have you known her?
A.. Five or six years.
Q. Do you see her in Puerto Rico from time to time?
A. I saw her many times in Mr. Powell's house in Puerto Rico.

Q. Have you ever seen Miss Flores in Mr. Powell's Washington congressional office or the committee office?

A. When I came to work for the committee, she was not in the committee.

Q. Where was she working then, if you know?
A. She was working in the Washington office for some time.
Q. In April 1965?

À. In April I don't know where she worked. I didn't see her here in Washington.

Q. Did you go to Mr. Powell's congressional office frequently during March and April of 1965?

A. In the Washington office?
Q. Yes.
A. Yes; many times.
Q. Did you ever see Miss Flores there?
A. No; I never did.

Q. Have you been in Mr. Powell's New York office or the committee's New York office during the past 2 years?

A. When the office was there, I was there always.
Q. Did you ever see Miss Flores there?
A. No; I never did.

Q. Do you know whether or not Miss Flores has ever done any work in Mr. Powell's offices in Washington or his offices in New York during the past 2 years?

A. No; I don't know, sir.

Q. Have you had any conversations with Miss Flores about what services she does for Mr. Powell?

A. No; I visited them socially in Puerto Rico. I never got involved into what she was doing or not doing for the committee.

Q. Do you know if she has any employment in Puerto Rico at this time?

A. Not that I know.

Q. Do you know whether she has had any employment in Puerto Rico other than working for Mr. Powell during the past 2 years?

A. Not that I know, sir.
Mr. TAYLOR. That is all that I have.

By Mr. O'CONNOR:
Q. Would you have talked to Miss Flores within the last week?
A. No; I haven't seen her in the last 4 or 5 months.

Q. You had no conversation about your coming up here or her coming up here?

A. I only spoke to Mr. Hoover who went to see me at my home a few days before on this committee affair and he asked me many questions. So I told him I was ready to sign an affidavit if that would prevent me from coming to Washington because I am very much involved in a political party there. He said, "I will talk to the Washington office and if they will permit it, I will let you know."

He never called me back.

Q. Mr. Vidal, would you care to identify the political party or whoever it was you were working with in New York?

A. In New York I was, in 1960

Q. 1965 when you made this trip to Puerto Rico and the trips down there.

A. This is a party that the Puerto Ricans want to found in New York. It is going to be the People's Party. It will be a new registered Puerto Rican party in New York. We have been working

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