Senator WARREN. Mr. Chairman, I am a little bit rusty in this socalled Appalachian purchase. Do we have any cooperation on the part of the States after we make these purchases, or is it just a matter of United States reservations which we have to appropriate all the money for? Secretary WILSON. There is no cooperation. Senator WARREN. I assumed there was not. Secretary WILSON. The United States buys out and out. Senator WARREN. And takes care of them in the same manner as those that are made from the public land? Secretary WILSON. Yes, and it takes quite a while to get title, however. Some of these are old lands. The CHAIRMAN. And pending the negotiations this provision is to secure and protect against fire? Secretary WILSON. Absolutely; we would put a man on each of the new forests. Senator WARREN. Under some amicable arrangement with the owners, I suppose? Secretary WILSON. I suppose that they would like to have it. Senator WARREN. But, naturally, you are trenching upon other properties-property belonging to other people? Secretary WILSON. Yes, but it is well understood that we have bought them, but we do not pay for them until we get the title to them. The CHAIRMAN. The next proposed amendment is on page 46, line 10, striking out "18" and inserting "25," also inserting the word "one" in lieu of "four," and striking out "20" and inserting "80"; so as to make the line read "$25,180," instead of $18,420." Secretary WILSON. The House committee has reduced the appropriation for investigation of the range conditions within national forests, and of methods of improving the range by reseeding, regulations for grazing, and by other means. They reduced our estimate some $6,000. Mr. ZAPPONE. $6,760. The committee of the House reduced the estimates for investigations of range conditions on the National forests by $6,760. Although the range within the forests has improved within the past seven years as a result of preventing continued overstocking and carefully regulating its use, a great portion of the area is still below a condition of maximum productivity. The grazing studies are designed to develop methods of range improvement which will permit utilizing the forage and at the same time bring about an improvement of the range by natural reseeding of the native plants; and to improve the methods of handling stock. The work so far done has proved of enormous practical value. The national forest ranges contribute largely to the meat supply, and it is believed that the present condition of the ranges and the present methods of handling stock can be improved so as to result in the production of from 15 to 25 per cent more beef and mutton on the area now used. The force of investigators employed at present is not large enough to carry on the work in all of the districts, and the increased appropriation is asked for in order to increase the force and extend the work to all six districts. Secretary WILSON. And we are putting it back to the same as it appears in our estimate. The CHAIRMAN. That is in line 10, is it? Secretary WILSON. Yes, sir. Now we propose that the paragraph beginning on page 46, line 11, shall read as follows: For the purchase of tree seed, cones, and nursery stock for seeding and tree planting within national forests, and for experiments and investigations necessary for such seeding and tree planting, $186,640. They cut that down to $150,000. Now, if there is one thing that I am anxious about in the forests it is the reseeding. It is a new question. We are doing the research work ourselves. Reseeding as it has been taught in our colleges and in foreign countries is done with a spade by the way of nursery. We have probably 15,000,000 acres to reseed, and it occurred to some of us that there were not spades enough in America to do the work, even if we had the Army and the Navy to help us; there would not be people enough. Fifteen million acres is a good deal of land. So we are experimenting all along the line. We sow seed as the farmer sows grass seed, sometimes Senator WARREN. Out of hand? Secretary WILSON. Out of hand, on the last snow in the spring, and have had remarkable success. We are trying every way possible to get them up, and we have brought up the amount of acreage that we can reseed now under all these new methods to 30,000 a year, and we would be pretty old men before we would get through this. The CHAIRMAN. The amount that you have stated, $186,640, was in your estimate, was it, in the first place? Secretary WILSON. Yes, sir; and in your conference with the House committee, I want to say, Mr. Chairman, that I would rather see you cut down anything else than that. The CHAIRMAN. Now, there is a further provision on page 46 that is proposed to be added at the end of line 14, as follows: Provided, That the Secretary of Agriculture may procure such seed, cones, and nursery stock by open purchase without advertisements for proposals whenever, in his discretion, such method is most economical and in the public interest. Secretary WILSON. We have prepared a long paper on that giving the reasons why that should be done. You go way off and there are some Indians who have gathered some seeds, and it is not practicable to advertise for those fellows, and sometimes we find it wise to just buy the seed out and out and pay the money for it. Senator CHAMBERLAIN. Sometimes you rob the squirrel nests? Senator PERKINS. I am surprised that the House did not look with favor upon this reseeding proposition. Secretary WILSON. There is a long paper here on that subject which I have among these papers. The CHAIRMAN. Suppose you hand that to the stenographer, and it will be inserted in the record. The paper referred to is as follows: REFORESTATION. The estimates called for a total appropriation of $186,640 for reforestation. This was cut down by the committee of the House to $150,000. This work is of the greatest importance and it would be a misfortune to curtail it at all. The work is well organized and practical results are being secured. It is desired to reforest at the rate of at least 30,000 acres a year, which will be possible under the appropriation requested. The words "cones and nursery stock" have been added to this subappropriation; also the following proviso, as explained in the attached papers: "Provided, That the Secretary of Agriculture may procure such seed, cones, and nursery stock by open purchase without advertisements for proposals whenever, in his discretion, such method is most economical and in the public interests." [Memorandum for the Forester.] The attached amendment to the pending appropriation bill for the department is suggested. Section 3709 of the Revised Statutes of the United States prescribes as follows: "All purchases and contracts for supplies or services in any of the departments of the Government, except for personal services, shall be made by advertising a sufficient time previously for proposals respecting the same when the public exigencies do not require the immediate delivery of the articles or performance of the service. When immediate delivery or performance is required by the public exigency, the articles or service required may be procured by open purchase or contract, at the places and in the manner in which such articles are usually bought and sold or such services engaged, between individuals." The appropriation act for the Department of Agriculture approved March 1, 1899, modified section 3709 of the Revised Statutes as applied to purchases and contracts made by this department, by requiring advertisements or proposals only when the total value of the articles or services required exceeds $50. All purchases of cones, seed, or nursery stock exceeding $50 in amount must therefore either follow requests for bids, which requests must be advertised for a sufficient period to secure proposals, unless public exigencies will not permit this delay. In that case a special exigency statement must be submitted with the voucher, showing that the delay occasioned by advertisement for bids and the conditions under which the articles were purchased would not permit the following of the regular procedure. Our purchases of seeds and cones particularly are made very largely from mountaineers, settlers in the forests, Indians, and similar classes of labor. The purchases are necessarily restricted to people of these classes, as a rule, because they alone are familiar with the region and the work of seed collecting and are the only ones available who are able to supply the needs of the Government. Proposals for bids under such conditions are futile and often would involve delay which would greatly reduce the opportunities of the Government to secure the amount of seed required. Furthermore, in dealing with people of these classes in inaccessible regions where mail facilities are very poor, it is extremely difficult to secure bids made out in proper form in compliance with the fiscal regulations of the department. Many of the people who furnish seeds and cones, in fact, particularly Indians who have been frequently employed in this work, can not write, and it is impossible to carry out the prescribed method of procedure in purchases exceeding $50 in amount. Furthermore, collection must be confined to restricted localities where seed of certain species can be procured, and frequently where particular conditions as to elevation and climate are found. The period for collecting is also limited, seldom exceeding six weeks. These conditions make it extremely difficult to comply with the requirements of the Revised Statutes in reference to advertisements for proposals. This has resulted in the general use of "exigency purchases," supported by certified statements showing that the procedure prescribed by the Revised Statutes was inapplicable to the conditions under which the particular articles were procured. The Division of Accounts has had a great deal of trouble in having accounts for such purchases supported by exigency statements made out in proper form so as to be acceptable to the Treasury Department. Since these conditions apply so generally to this entire class of purchases it would seem proper to secure statutory authority to eliminate the necessity for exigency statements and advertisements for proposals. This has already been done by Congress in the case of the Bureau of Plant Industry, which purchases farm and garden seeds for distribution. The conditions under which tree seeds and cones are procured by the Forest Service make it far more difficult to comply with the customary fiscal regulations because of the character of the labor which must be employed and the inaccessible regions in which the work is done. The handling of this work in the field and its auditing and accounting would be materially simplified and facilitated by the adoption of the foregoing amendment. The wording of the amendment has been approved by Mr. Williams, of the Solicitor's office. W. B. GREELEY, Assistant Forester. The CHAIRMAN. The next proposed amendment is on page 47, line 5, striking out the word "two" and the words "and seventy-five," so as to make the line read, "five hundred thousand dollars" instead of "two hundred and seventy-five thousand dollars." Secretary WILSON. I suppose you will have some trouble with the House people with regard to that. This is a sum of money to make trails and make bridges and roads and all that kind of thing through forests, and there has been a great deal of pressure from these western gentlemen about that. Senator WARREN. Mr. Secretary, that covers the expense of building roads that are necessary to freely circulate through your forests, and to reduce as much as you can the expenditures even of your regular force, but especially so in case of fire when you have to call in help? Secretary WILSON. Yes, sir. Senator WARREN. And they serve in a measure as a furrow does in a grass fire Secretary WILSON. It is the same thing. Senator WARREN. The road is a line that oftentimes will stop a fire? Secretary WILSON. Yes, sir. Senator WARREN. Now, do you feel that heretofore you have proceeded any too rapidly in road building? Secretary WILSON. No, sir; I think not. Senator WARREN. And, of course, we know that you have not completed these roads, but you feel as if it were successful as far as you have gone and that we ought to continue the putting in of sufficient roads to get control of it? Secretary WILSON. I think so. Senator WARREN. I have had an idea that some of the particular roads I have talked with the forestry people-especially some of those leading into our national resorts that you have not yet been able to finish, were sufficiently improved, so that in raising this appropriation, if we should conclude to do it, we might name certain small sums that could be expended in certain specific localities. I say that because I think it would be more acceptable to Congress in making the appropriations. Have you considered that view of it at all? Secretary WILSON. I suppose some localities in the West would be glad to contribute a per cent of the expense under such conditions as you have described. Senator CHAMBERLAIN. It has been so in my State. Secretary WILSON. I remember being out there looking through the forests when I met some eastern people who had periodically, every year, gone to Switzerland, and they loaded up their touring cars and came to the Rocky Mountains to see whether they would like it there. They found the scenery, they found the hotels, but they did not find the roads; and if we are going to turn that tide of American tourists, who spend millions of dollars abroad, to our own western country we have to build these roads for them. Senator WARREN. And that in addition to the practical side of the use for foresters. Secretary WILSON. They will leave the money out there. Senator WARREN. With regard to what you say, last summer I went home from here and spent as much time as I could in that forest reservation, not only in my own State but in the adjoining State. I know that in my own State three counties have already arranged to cooperate, and I know in one case, for instance, if the United States would spend, say, $6,000 more there would be an automobile road from the south clear to the boundaries of the park where they are inhibited from going through with automobiles. In other words, say a $6,000 expenditure, if you allow them to come in and match up to it, would probably secure a thirty or forty thousand dollar expenditure, the most of which you get the benefit of in your forest surveys, because they in turn feel they get the benefit of your work on these main trails. What is true there would be true, I presume, in some of the other States. I wanted to throw the idea out. We may want to take it up later and consider it. The CHAIRMAN. May I ask whether the opening of the roads makes available large timber tracts for the purpose of sale? Secretary WILSON. They do. We have been lately compelled to increase the length of time in a contract in order that the contractor might have time to get way back into the mountains with provisions even, and with his horses. The CHAIRMAN. The next proposed amendment seems to be at the top of page 48, on the second line. That is a matter that has been discussed more or less. Suppose you read it, Mr. Zappone. Mr. ZAPPONE. I will read the proviso: Any contract or agreement heretofore or hereafter made for the sale of timber or other products of the national forests may be modified, altered, or cancelled by the Secretary of Agriculture upon the application of the purchaser whenever the purchaser shall show to the satisfaction of the Secretary that, owing to conditions beyond the purchaser's control and arising subsequent to the execution of the contract the enforcement thereof will work serious hardship or injustice to the purchasers: Provided, That the United States shall in all such cases be fully reimbursed for any expenses or damages incurred in connection with said contract: Provided further, That in no case shall the stumpage price stipulated in the contract or agreement be reduced by such modification or alteration: And provided also, That nothing herein shall be construed to limit the authority of the Secretary of Agriculture to modify, alter, or cancel any such contract or agreement for violation of its terms. That was submitted to the House committee, but got in too late to be included in the bill and was submitted as an amendment by Capt. Lamb on the floor of the House. It went out on a point of order. Senator WARREN. Just what was the cause for that, please? Mr. ZAPPONE. It is quite a story. Senator WARREN. Just state it briefly. ex Mr. ZAPPONE. Contracts for the sale of national-forest timber were originally framed in the belief that their terms could subsequently be modified by the Secretary or other administrative officer of the department in any manner not inconsistent with the laws relating to such sales, when such action would in his judgment be to the public interests. The language of these contracts did not, therefore, pressly provide for their modification, that being deemed a matter of administrative discretion whenever it might be found necessary. The decision rendered by the Comptroller of the Treasury, dated December 27, 1911, and other existing legal authorities and precedents, make it impossible to modify the terms of such contracts except within very narrow limits. It seems probable that a change in the wording of the contracts will permit future modifications to a much greater extent than is possible in the case of the contracts now existing. Immediate legislation is necessary to make it possible to adjust the outstanding contracts, |