Do you think that any of the shipowners or operators, through neglect of the men on the ship, are in any way responsible for these conditions?

Commander FIELD. That was generally recognized to be the fact in the past. Almost everyone who knows about maritime labor conditions will tell you that the situation leading up to the organization of this rank and file union which has developed into the N. M. U. and which has become so powerful in the last year or two was brought about by lack of foresight and lack of regard for the welfare of the men, giving them as low pay as they could, and giving them bad quarters on board ship over a period of a good many years.

I believe, from the indications that I have seen, that the owners have now been brought to proper terms and conditions in regard to such things are being exploited beyond what is proper.

Senator MALONEY. How recently has that corruption you assume taken place?

Commander FIELD. I would say within the last 3 years, sir, in a great many cases.

Senator MALONEY. You do not mean to say that for the last 3 years, for the last 2 years, or even for the last year conditions on all of these ships have been proper for the men, do you?

Commander FIELD. No, sir; I would not state that.

Senator MALONEY. It is still pretty sad in some instances?

Commander FIELD. Yes. There may be instances where the conditions are bad, but the demands of the crews in the last few years have extended to trivialities. They want ice cream freezers, or they want coffee percolators. When they are demanding those things and getting them, you may be sure that they have already covered the matter of proper bunks, proper toilets, and shower-bath facilities. I would not want to say, however, that the living conditions in all ship's are all that they should be.

Senator MALONEY. Some of them right now, I have been told by people high in authority in the Government, are still pretty sad. Commander FIELD. I have no doubt there are some that are that

way.

The CHAIRMAN. I think that what Senator Maloney has said is true, but the pathetic thing about it is that those physical conditions on a ship are due to a great extent to the wartime conditions under which those ships are built. Most of those ships that are bitterly complained of are old Shipping Board ships and did not give any regard to the crews.

As a result of our investigation into the Moro Castle disaster, we had two technical committees; one presided over by Admiral Rock, which committee has formulated rules of construction which are now to be used in the construction of all our ships. As I have already explained to you, the sister ship of the Queen Mary is to be built according to those rules.

More than that, under Admiral Hamlet, who is here this morning, the other committee-the personnel committee-went very extensively into the matter of living conditions of crews.

This is going to take a long time, and indeed so far as some ships are concerned they will never be corrected. The crowded quarters, insanitary conditions, and unhygienic conditions under which these men live can never be corrected until those ships are entirely remodeled.

The ships which Mr. Kennedy and his group are now building will afford all of those facilities, but it is physically impossible to remodel these older ships with a view to improving the crew quarters without utterly destroying all freight capacity.

Senator MALONEY. It is a shame that the Government subsidizes that kind of ship. I think that no one has been more concerned with the welfare of the men who work on the ships than you have been, Mr. Chairman.

The CHAIRMAN. I am glad to hear you say that, because it offsets the "picketing" of the sailors who say that I have not done what you say I have done.

Senator MALONEY. If they had attended the meetings of this committee for the last few years, they would not feel that way.

The CHAIRMAN. A prominent member of the Senate told me the other day that I received a lot of bricks and clubs that I did not deserve, but I do not care about that. If we can build up a merchant marine, that is what I am interested in doing.

Senator MALONEY. I am distressed by the conditions which prevail and would like to see something done about them. I hope that we will not overlook the fact that these men have been subjected, in some instances, to conditions that amount to serfdom.

The CHAIRMAN. No honest man can take any other view.

Senator GIBSON. I think the conditions spoken of by the Senator from Connecticut exist on ships recently built.

The CHAIRMAN. That is, on board ships that were built under the Jones-White Act?

Senator GIBSON. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. I think that is true, but that will not be the case. in all ships built from this time forward. I think it was a crime against humanity that greater consideration was not given to the living conditions of the sailors. It has not been right at all. I have no excuse to make for anybody, so far as that is concerned.

Senator GIBSON. Is it not true that on the Manhattan and on the Washington the crews are living under bad conditions?

The CHAIRMAN. I think it has been true until, as the Commander has said, very recently.

Senator GIBSON. Possibly a better word to use would be "crowded" conditions.

The CHAIRMAN. I think there have been improvements in that respect, but we still have much to expect.

Commander Field, have you something more to add?
Commander FIELD. I think not.

The CHAIRMAN. I want to ask about these three other cases, so that we will have all of them in the record. The ninth one was this:

On September 4, 1937, the Consul at Yokohama, Japan, reported the disorderly conduct of members of the crew of the S. S. President Hoover, growing out of drunkenness on shore. He said "Previous cases have brought American seamen and shipping into disrepute in the eyes of the community and of the people and officials of Japan" and said that it was becoming increasingly difficult to obtain cooperation from police.

Have you anything relating to that?

Commander FIELD. I have the same report. Seven members of the crew of the S. S. President Hoover failed to join ship when it sailed on September 3, 1937. They were in trouble there. The Consul got them out of trouble and placed them in steerage passage on board

the President McKinley for return to the United States. The men said that the steerage was not good enough for them and demanded a better class of accommodations. When it was denied to them, they went ashore, which was against police restrictions, and caused more trouble with the police.

I found nothing in the report to indicate the final disposal of those men. It may be that they had got back aboard the President McKinley.

The CHAIRMAN. The President Hoover?

Commander FIELD. No, sir; they were placed in steerage on the President McKinley after the President Hoover had sailed.

The CHAIRMAN. Oh, yes.

Commander FIELD. This was just one of those cases of misconduct ashore which does not come within the jurisdiction of our bureau. The CHAIRMAN. The articles of agreement speak about being on shore?

Commander FIELD. They speak of the stores of the ship.

I have a few more of these incidents.

The CHAIRMAN. Let me give you these remaining two, and then I shall be through with what I have.

The tenth one reads:

On September 26, 1937, the Consul at Havre, France, reported a sit-down strike on the S. S. Nashaba, then in dry dock at that point. His investigation disclosed that the conduct and complaints of the crew were entirely unjustified. He went into some detail as to the conditions obtaining. This he did in detail

because he wanted to "bring to the Department's attention the increasing disregard for discipline and spirit of unrest which is unfortunately being manifested among crews of American vessels and the trivial and insignificant pretext on which a strike movement on board an American vessel in a foreign port may be based."

Have you any information about that?

Commander FIELD. Captain Merrill tells me that is being investigated and will be gone into fully as soon as the ship returns to the United States.

The CHAIRMAN. The eleventh case is the case of the Algic, in which there already have been convictions.

Did you say that you had some other matters, Commander Field? Commander FIELD. Here is an example of a vague report that we got. It was postmarked at Hamburg, was addressed to the Secretary of Commerce, was not dated, was received in the Department on December 2, 1937, and was signed by six persons, presumably the officers, in which is made a general plea for betterment of conditions. One paragraph says:

Please relieve us of our oaths or do something to put our merchant service on sounder foundations. With the conditions as they exist today no American ship can operate safely or successfully.

We are pleading to you to do something or we may as well give up this feeble attempt of ours to have an American merchant marine service.

As officers, we are tired of being looked upon as clowns for every other maritime nation on earth. If a little alien, namely, Harry Bridges, and others of his type, are going to run our ships, why should we go to the trouble of examinations for officers' licenses, the issuance of which should invest some respect and obedience. We have reached the end and are pleading to you. For God's sake do something before conditions get much worse, if that is possible.

Senator MALONEY. That is from officers?
Commander FIELD. Presumably; yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Commander, is it not a fact that many of the masters and most of the officers belong to the Masters', Mates', and Pilots' Union or the Marine Engineers' Beneficial Association, affiliated with the labor federations?

Commander FIELD. Yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. In consequence, are they not bound to carry out. the union activities of the seamen?

Commander FIELD. To what extent the officer is hampered by the union activity, I am not thoroughly familiar. The officers' union is a separate union and is affiliated, in some cases, with the same master organization that the N. M. U. is affiliated with.

The CHAIRMAN. Is it not a new thing for a master of a ship to become a member of a union?

Commander FIELD. I will ask Mr. Sanders. Are masters generally members of a union?

Mr. SANDERS. No; not as a rule.

The CHAIRMAN. Is it not a new thing that they are joining a union? Mr. SANDERS. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. The answer is "yes"?

Commander FIELD. Yes; within the last 18 months.

The CHAIRMAN. Have you any knowledge of whether or not those members were physically forced to join the union?

Mr. SANDERS. It has been stated that their families had been threatened if they did not join, and while they were at sea. Of course, that I could not prove. We do know of cases that have been tried,

and it was found that the families had been threatened.

a case up near where you live, Senator.

The CHAIRMAN. Yes; up near Spring Valley.

We had such

Senator VANDENBERG. Do you mean that a man has been tried in court?

The CHAIRMAN. Yes; and the chief defendant committed suicide to save his union from embarrassment.

Have you any more to add, Commander?
Commander FIELD. No, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Commissioner Daly, have you anything more to say?

Commissioner DALY. The fact that the licensed officers-the deck officers, engineers' officers, and radio operators-went on the picket line together during the strike in New York has brought about a feeling of comradeship, and, of course, that creates an atmosphere in which it is very difficult to maintain discipline.

Senator VANDENBERG. The captains and the other officers?
Commissioner DALY. I would not say the captains.

The Chairman. Officers.

Commissioner DALY. The chief mates, second mates, third mates,
chief engineers, some first assistants, second and third-
The Chairman. They were on the picket lines?
Commissioner DALY. On the picket lines.

Senator GIBSON. All groups under captain or master?
Commissioner DALY. Yes.

Senator VANDENBERG. I know of a captain who was forced to picket his own ship in San Francisco.

Commissioner DALY. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. Have you anything else to add?

Commissioner DALY. I concur with you on the conditions that we had up to 1934. The conditions aboard ships were terrible. Wages were down as low as $17.50 and $20 a month. We had licensed men and captains going out as able seamen and quartermasters. We had chief engineers going out as oilers and water tenders. Unlicensed men were paid as little as $17.50 a month. The shipowner has always been his worst enemy. This might be considered retribution, or the men getting back into power.

The CHAIRMAN. Do your experience and memory go back to the time when seamen had the power that they now have?

Commissioner DALY. No, sir; not at all.

Senator MALONEY. They never had any power in the old days. They had no power at all if they got only $17.50 a month.

The CHAIRMAN. May I ask you, Admiral Hamlet, if you investigated any of these complaints from members of crews?

Admiral HAMLET. We looked into them and studied them; yes, sir. The CHAIRMAN. How many were there?

Admiral HAMLET. About 100 separate ones. Many of them were repetitions.

Captain JOYCE. Even among that hundred there were a number of reports of the same incident, so there were probably 90, or something of that sort.

The CHAIRMAN. Is it or is it not a fact that these complaints were submitted by the Bureau to your committee, Admiral, and were all given consideration?

Admiral HAMLET. Yes, sir; we gave them consideration.

The CHAIRMAN. You received reports at that time from Mr. Weaver?

Admiral HAMLET. Yes, sir; we had Mr. Weaver over here.

The CHAIRMAN. Did your investigation find that most of these reports were substantial or otherwise?

Admiral HAMLET. Most of them were trivial.

Senator THOMAS of Utah. May I ask one question that is bothering us all the time?

The CHAIRMAN. Yes.

Senator THOMAS of Utah. We are faced with the word "Communist" whichever way we turn in most of our labor legislation. Is there in existence now a Communist ship? Have you ever seen one?

Commissioner DALY. No, sir; I have only heard of one, and that was where the crew was supposed to have taken the authority away from the master and compelled the master to pay a sum of money for a communistic purpose. As I said before, we sifted that down for about a month in New York, and we could not find the name of the ship and we could not find the name of the master. I traced it to four or five lines, and, of course, they denied it, and I could not go any further.

Senator THOMAS of Utah. Do the ships which now fly the Russian flag have communistic rules among their sailors?

Commissioner DALY. I did visit a ship that came into New York, flying the Russian flag. I was fortunate in having a young woman aboard the ship who understood English, so I could question the crew of that ship. I found absolutely no discipline, but I believe that the crew knew what to do and did it. The mate evidently did not have to give an order. The crew knew what to do and did it. There