Mr. BOROW. I do not see that.

Senator ELLENDER. You would not go that far?

Mr. BOROW. No, sir.

Senator ELLENDER. That is not your purpose and your intention? Mr. BOROW. That is correct, sir.

Senator ELLENDER. All right.

Mr. BOROW. Further on Mr. Jackson states, commenting upon the recent report of the Maritime Commission:

The third great problem of the industry is that of stabilization or security of maritime labor. No one with a sense of social responsibility today questions the right of labor to bargain collectively and secure for itself its full share of participation in an industry. It is the accomplishment of this purpose to stabilize the advantages to which labor is entitled that has led the Maritime Commission to advocate the creation of a Ship Labor Mediation Board.

The creation of a mediation board will protect labor against the sudden and unwarranted reduction in wages which have sometimes come about in periods of economic depression.

It is impossible for maritime labor to reconcile such pronouncements coming from a company whose past and even present record of unfair labor practices has so vividly impressed itself upon those who fell under the blow of its incessant antiunion onslaughts.

Senator VANDENBERG. Under what registry are these other United Fruit Co. ships, which are not under American registry?

Mr. BOROW. Mostly the Central American countries, sir.

Senator VANDENBERG. Do you not think perhaps they may have to make some concessions, by way of recognizing Central American sovereignties, inasmuch as their operations are conducted there as much as they are up here? In other words, is that a legitimate criticism of them, in view of their operations?

Mr. BoRow. I believe so. Because plenty of the Scandanavian countries run their vessels all over the world, and some never go back to a Scandanavian country; and yet they continue to carry the flag of their own nation.

Senator VANDENBERG. Yes. But they do not have large investments in the land of the particular countries. For instance, the United Fruit Co. has enormous land investments in Guatemala. Suppose Guatemala insists on having a ship or two under its registry. Then do you not think the United Fruit Co. might have to take Guatemalan registry, now and then, under those circumstances?

And you realize, I am sure, that I have no interest in the situation. Mr. BOROW. Well, perhaps they have. But you realize that the authorities in those countries do not tell the United Fruit Co. what to do. Precisely the reverse is true.

Senator VANDENBERG. Well, it just seems to me that that criticism might be unfair. But I do not know anything about the facts.

Mr. BOROW. I have a bit of evidence here, in support of Mr. Curran's testimony, regarding training ships, in his prepared statement. In Mr. Curran's prepared statement, we have the following sentence, under the subject of training ships:

During the maritime strikes of 1936 and 1937, the shipowners themselves, in cooperation with certain discredited officials of the International Seamen's Union, scoured the inland towns and farms for young men and boys with whom to man their ships.

Here I have an affidavit, dated at Philadelphia, December 3, 1936, [reading]:

PHILADELPHIA, PA., December 3, 1936.

I, Fred Himmelein, captain of tug Atlantic City, owned and operated by the Pennsylvania Railroad Co., make the following statement of my own free will and accord:

I declare that I am a legal resident and property owner in the town of Veriga, N. J., which is located between South Westville and National Park, N. J.

That on or about December 1, 1936, approximately 10 boys and men were recruited from the town of Veriga, N. J., to ship out as unlicensed members of the crews of certain tankers, probably the steamship Sylvan Arrow and steamship Paulsboro, from Paulsboro, N. J.

That is the Socony-Vacuum Transportation Co. [continuing to read]:

That I know all of these boys by sight and am personally acquainted with at least five of them; they are Jack Calout, who is under care and custody of the probation officer; William Press; a man by the name of Blair; a boy by the name of Cooper; two brothers by the name of Goredy; and approximately four others. That the majority of the above-named are under 18 years of age and only a few, i. e., Cooper, one of the Goredy brothers, and possibly Blair have had any experi

ence at sea.

That if these inexperienced men presented discharges, certifying discharges from previous ships, they must necessarily have been falsified or altered.

My commission expires March 25, 1937. (The above paper is filed with the clerk of the Commerce Committee.)

The CHAIRMAN. It will be received for the record.

Senator VANDENBERG. What does that prove, in connection with this bill?

Mr. BOROW. This was on the question of training ships, sir.

Senator VANDENBERG. You would not have a man like that from a training ship, would you?

Mr. BOROW. Pardon me?

Senator VANDENBERG. Would you have men such as you described in that affidavit from the training ships?

Mr. BOROW. No, sir; but that is not the point at all.

Senator VANDENBERG. It is not? Then, what is the point? Mr. BOROW. The point is that certain shipowners claim they want trained and experienced men. But when they have the opportunity to get these men, instead of doing that, they scour the inland towns and get these farmers. Many of these men have since become expert and helped in their training by the union men who are now on the vessels. We feel that the position taken by the shipowners in this respect is certainly one that is not justified. They could have had many experienced men in the past, but they preferred to get men like these.

Senator VANDENBERG. How about the position taken by the Maritime Commission: That things of this sort would be minimized if we had training? I should think that would be an argument in favor of adequate training, rather than against it.

Mr. BOROW. Well, under certain condition we are interested and in favor of adequate training. Naturally under certain conditions everybody would have to be.

The CHAIRMAN. We have certain training schools, one in Boston, one in Philadelphia, and in New York, and on the Pacific coast. What is your attitude toward those?

Mr. BOROW. The attitude of the A. R. T. A.? Why, we give preference, as we stated before, to all men having experience or discharges from either Government-supervised places or coming from the Regular Army and Navy and Coast Guard.

Senator VANDENBERG. Can they always get into your union?
Mr. BOROW. If anybody can get in, those men can get in.

Senator VANDENBERG. That is it, if anybody can get in. If you transfer your closed list from the west to the east coast, then there is no chance for anybody to get in, is there? Don't you have a monopoly of the entire situation?

Mr. BOROW. Well, I would not call it a monopoly.

Senator VANDENBERG. Would you like to transfer the western practice to the east coast?

Mr. BOROW. Well, such a practice would only be adopted when it would be absolutely necessary.

Senator VANDENBERG. I was asking how you felt about it.

Mr. BOROW. If it becomes absolute necessary, there is only one thing to do. We are interested in protection and stabilization for American citizens engaged in this industry.

Senator VANDENBERG. I am for American citizens engaged in this industry. Some of your officials are not American citizens, are they? Mr. BOROW. You have to be an American citizen to belong to the A. R. T. A., in the first place,

Senator VANDENBERG. I am glad to know that.

The CHAIRMAN. Are all union officials American citizens?

Mr. BOROW. I do not know, sir.

Senator VANDENBERG. Are all the union officials on the west coast American citizens?

Mr. BoRow. I do not know, sir; I have enough to do to take care of this side.

Senator VANDENBERG. Is Mr. Harry Bridges an American citizen? Mr. BOROW. I do not know, sir. I believe he has taken out his naturalization papers.

The CHAIRMAN. How many times?

Mr. BOROW. I do not know.

Senator VANDENBERG. I like your emphasis on American citizens. I like to agree with you on that.

Mr. BOROW. Well, our constitution specifically states you must be an American citizen before you can become a member of the union. The CHAIRMAN. Are you under any direction from Mr. Harry Bridges?

Mr. BOROW. You mean me, personally?

The CHAIRMAN. No; your union.

Mr. BOROW. No, sir; we are not under direction from anybody.
The CHAIRMAN. Are you associated with any other unions?
Mr. BOROW. We have our own autonomy.

The CHAIRMAN. But are you associated with the other unions?
Mr. BOROW. Well, of course, we cooperate, one with the other.
The CHAIRMAN. You are representing, in your appearance here,
just what group? What did you say, yesterday?

Mr. BOROW. The American Radio Telegraphists' Association.

The CHAIRMAN. Well, go ahead. I think you gave us the impression that Mr. Harry Bridges has nothing to do with you, or your supervision or direction?

Mr. BOROW. No, sir. Of course if Mr. Bridges has a good idea, or if any of you gentlemen have a good idea, that we could use, why, we certainly will use it.

Senator VANDENBERG. What is Mr. Bridges' official position with the union?

Mr. BOROW. I understand he is president of the Pacific coast district of the International Longshoremen's and Warehousemen's Association. I believe that is what it is.

Senator VANDENBERG. How can that be, if you say that your own regulations require that all officers should be citizens?

Mr. BOROW. Mr. Henry Bridges is not a member of the A. R. T. A. Senator VANDENBERG. Oh, I see.

The CHAIRMAN. Does he have anything to do, directly or indirectly, with your union?

Mr. BOROW. Well, there may be an exchange of ideas.

The CHAIRMAN. I am not talking about that. I mean in his official relations.

Mr. BOROW. No, sir-well, he is not an officer of the A. R. T. A. The CHAIRMAN. That is all right. But has he anything to do, directly or indirectly, with your organization?

Mr. BOROW. The A. R. T. A. has dealings with Mr. Bridges as president of a union belonging to the Maritime Federation of the Pacific coast.

The CHAIRMAN. And did you say that Mr. Bridges is not a citizen? Mr. BOROW. I did not say such a thing, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Well, is he a citizen?

Mr. BOROW. My only understanding of the situation is that he has taken out naturalization papers.

The CHAIRMAN. Was there a period when he was in his official position, and when he had no papers?

Mr. BOROW. I have no knowledge of that.

The CHAIRMAN. All right; go ahead.

Mr. BOROW. I have here some evidence of collusion by shipowners or their agents to circumvent the aims and purposes of the Wagner Act. On this question may we quote the statement of Charles Fahy, general counsel of the National Labor Relations Board, as submitted under questioning at the National Association of Manufacturers convention, at New York, concluded December 9 [reading]:

You want to impose on labor unions a more drastic regulation. You advocate putting unions out of business. That would be unfair unless the employer could also be put out of business. It is the duty of the Board to administer and enforce this statute without fear or favoritism, but it is also your duty, the duty of employers, to comply with it frankly, openly, and without reserve. Collective bargaining cannot exist in the face of employer coercion of individual employees in their choice of bargaining agents.

I should like to stress that last clause again:

Collective bargaining cannot exist in the face of employer coercion of individual employees in their choice of bargaining agent.

Senator VANDENBERG. Cannot you broaden that statement: You could not have proper collective bargaining if there is any coercion or intimidation anywhere, on either side?

32437-37-pt. 4— 3

Mr. BOROW. Generally speaking; yes, sir.

Senator VANDENBERG. Yes; I agree that the employer must not coerce. And neither must anybody else. Is that true?

Mr. BOROW. Generally speaking, I would say that is true, sir. Maritime labor sincerely feels and earnestly believes that if all the shipowners would only accept these few cardinal points, instead of seeking to evade them, then the hazards that now beset us would vanish into thin air.

Now, gentlemen, on this matter of employer coercion of individuals, I should like to submit two affidavits, with particular reference to our craft.

The CHAIRMAN. We shall receive them for the record. Can you tell us in a word what they are?

Mr. BoRow. In a few words, they give evidence where the agents of the company actually coerced radio operators from dropping their affiliations with the A. R. T. A., and to join a company-controlled organization instead.

The CHAIRMAN. How long ago did that happen?

Mr. BOROW. August 2, 1937, and July 28 of this year.

The CHAIRMAN. Those are the dates of the affidavits. But when did the events take place?

Mr. BOROW. The event took place, in one case, on July 29.

The CHAIRMAN. Of this year?

Mr. BOROW. Yes, sir; and in the other case, July 26.

The CHAIRMAN. Both the same line?

Mr. BOROW. Pardon me, sir?

The CHAIRMAN. The same steamship line?

Mr. BOROW. Let me see, please [examining the papers]. This one here is from the Savannah Line-both from the Savannah Line. The CHAIRMAN. Very well; they will be received for the record.

Go ahead.

(The papers referred to are as follows:)

MORT. BOROW, Secretary.

NEW YORK, N. Y., August 2, 1937.

DEAR BROTHER BOROW: On July 29, 1937, in Boston, Mass., an I. S. U. delegate and representing the C. T. U., boarded the vessel, steamship City of St. Louis, upon which I had been employed 5 months as a radio operator, and still was employed in that capacity. The delegate, Mr. Martin, said I had to join the C. T. U. or he would tie up the ship, as the crew and longshoremen were backing him. I refused to join. The first officer, Mr. Momborquette, came to the radio room and said he had to pay me off. He advised me to join C. T. U. and offered to lend me money for that purpose. Later in the captain's office, Captain Riser also offered to lend me the money to join C. T. U.

I was paid off and left the ship. All this took place 15 minutes before scheduled sailing time.

Respectfully,

CHARLES A. QUINN,
Book No. 241-2.

A DEPOSITION

NEW YORK CITY, July 28, 1937.

I, Edgar S. Johnson, do hereby depose and state that the following is true and correct to the best of my knowledge and belief:

I am a radio officer employed aboard the Steamship City of Birmingham of the Ocean Steamship Co. (Savannah Line). During the voyage from New York to Boston on July 24 and 25 while I was on watch in the radio room a man by the name of Mr. Martin, who claimed to be representing the United Licensed Officers