Mr. BOONE. Mr. Buckley, the first 85-foot antenna at Rosman was for the Weather Bureau station operation, was it not. Are you using it for other than Weather Bureau operations now? Mr. TRUSZYNSKI. May I answer that, Mr. Boone? At Rosman the first antenna facility was not for the Weather Bureau. As a matter of fact, none of the facilities at Rosman are planned for primary use on other than NASA satellites. The first antenna was installed for support of the Orbiting Geophysical Observatory class satellites. Mr. BOONE. You are not taking Weather Bureau data at Rosman now? Mr. TRUSZYNSKI. We are not taking Weather Bureau data. Mr. TRUSZYNSKI. That is right. Mr. Boon. The information released by the Weather Bureau, what will you use that for? Mr. TRUSZYNSKI. This is a VHF telemetry antenna, and will revert to use on other parts of Wallops programs. Actually, it is an antenna that is shared at the moment with the Weather Bureau on the Tiros satellites. Mr. ROUSH. If there are no further questions on this particular item, we will move on. Who is taking the next item, "Deep Space Network"? Mr. BUCKLEY. I am sir. Mr. ROUSH. All right, Mr. Buckley. Mr. BUCKLEY. Well, as you know, it is the Deep Space Network which is designed to support the unmanned lunar and planetary missions. However, in the last year the network has supported one Centaur launch and was supposed to support today's Centaur launching if it had been a success. It supported an Explorer, a vehicle called IMP which has a highly elliptical trajectory. The dish in Woomera, Australia, was used to help track that particular vehicle. Of course, the basic job of the network is tracking vehicles such as Mariner IV, that is now on its way to Mars, and Rangers VI, VII, and VIII. The Mariner IV support will continue until after the fly-by of Mars in July. At that time the vehicle will be 135 million miles away from the Earth. Previously our maximum communications distance has been out to about 50 million miles, so this will be much farther. During the rest of this fiscal year, the net work will support Ranger 9 and the Centaur (AC-6). During the fiscal year 1966 the Deep Space Network is scheduled to support the initial flights of Lunar Orbiter, which is being designed at our Langley Laboratory, Surveyor, which is the JPL project, and Pioneer, as well as two more Centaur launches. During the coming year, the network will be required to supply simultaneous support for extended periods of times of more than one mission. Now actually, 2 weeks ago, we had to support both Mariner and Ranger, but that was for a short period of time. In the coming year we will be supporting more than one mission for extended periods of time. The new 85-foot antenna station at Canberra, Australia, is now operational. Incidenally, it is not going to be dedicated until the 19th of March, but we had it pick up the Mariner spacecraft and follow it and get data from it in order that we could use the Woomera station on Ranger. The station under construction at Madrid is expected to become operational at the end of this fiscal year. During the fiscal year 1966 the Spacecraft Checkout Facility at Cape Kennedy will become operational, and there is a prototype 210-foot antenna facility being built at Goldstone, which will be completed during fiscal year 1966, and again will require some operational support. Looking at the changes in the dollar figures in the budget as we go from fiscal year 1965 to fiscal year 1966, there will be a $3.2 million increase resulting from the personnel costs for staffing the 85-foot antenna stations at Canberra and Madrid, and the 210-foot antenna station at Goldstone. In addition, there will be an increase of $1.1 million over last year, for logistic support and engineering improvements. This gives a total increase in this year's budget in the operations area of $4.3 million over last year. I might point out that the operations area is increasing, but as I mentioned, our equipment budget this year is lower than last year, and it is the decrease in the equipment that has resulted in the overall decrease in the budget. Mr. DAVIS. Mr. Chairman. Mr. ROUSH. Mr. Davis. Mr. DAVIS. I would like to ask a question or two about this space flight operations facility. Now that is essentially just a control, isn't it? Mr. BUCKLEY. That is right; yes, sir. Mr. DAVIS. Similar to the one you described at Goddard? Mr. DAVIS. I was wondering why it wouldn't have been easier to set up one at Goddard for deep space than it would out on the west coast? Mr. BUCKLEY. The JPL runs the Deep Space Network for us. JPL was in charge of the unmanned lunar and planetary programs almost completely until recently, and there now has been one project given to Ames and one to Langley. JPL is staffed for the job of running the network, handling the data that comes in from the network, and making the calculations. I think that the JPL probably is as far ahead as anybody else in the world right now in making the type of calculations that allow us to hit the moon with such exactness, and to pass so close to Mars. If we had brought that capability to Goddard-first of all, Goddard's control center will have a big job of its own working on their type of satellites-but if we had brought it there we would have had to bring a lot of the JPL people with it, the people who know how to perform these calculations. We would have had to import them into Goddard. Mr. DAVIS. Do they have anything at JPL as they do at Goddard, do they compare? Mr. BUCKLEY. In my area, they are quite comparable. JPL does not have the tremendous flood of scientific data coming in, and so they do not have as many computers. Mr. DAVIS. They have enough to handle this function that you set up, do they? Mr. BUCKLEY. Yes, sir. As a matter of fact they are changing it because they are learning what they ought to be doing out there. They are having quite a lot of discussions with the other centers, in attempting to determine the specific computers to be used. Mr. DAVIS. I would like to make the same request, too, as regard the Deep Space Network, if it would be convenient, to give us a list of them. I would like to have it included in the record. Mr. ROUSH. Without objection they will become a part of the record. Deep space network station locations: Goldstone, Calif.; Johannesburg, South Africa; Woomera, Australia; and Canberra, Australia. Are there other questions? Mr. Buckley, let me ask you this: Isn't our ability to explore space going to be somewhat limited by your ability in the case of track, or do you foresee the day when our exploration of deep space may be limited by our lack of ability to indicate tracks? Mr. BUCKLEY. I presume this question might have stemmed from an article in the Saturday Review by Dr. Drake, and also his participation in the National Science Foundation study on radio astronomy, where he advocated 100 85-foot dishes all operated, or located, in the same spot, and operated uniformly, or in the second case, he said 50 85-foot dishes. The 210-foot antenna being built at Goldstone is the prototype of a system which will advance our capability to a certain extent and it is living up to our expectations. When will our projects need a network of 210-foot dishes? I think the planning that is going on indicates that it will probably show up in our next year's budget. We are limited in the amount of weight we can put in deep space. Therefore, we are limited in the type of data that can be sent back. I think there is a balance in all this that will result in us not needing bigger dishes than the 210-foot ones for a few years. Mr. ROUSH. I observe from your statements, however, you are very cautious in this area, and give the idea that we can anticipate the day, perhaps, when we will be asking for funds for larger dishes. You don't say so, but you don't make the blank statement that the 210foot dish will be the ultimate. Mr. BUCKLEY. No, sir; I don't think it will, except through integrated planning between the vehicles that are going out and what they will be transmitting back. In the case of Mariner IV, we are going to take some television pictures of Mars which will be sent back over a number of hours, and not in real time. In other words, there are ways of getting around the limitations. The data can be stored and sent back. The point is that we can get into some very expensive installations if we don't watch out on this thing. I think it is proper that we study this thing continuously as we are doing and not go headlong into trying to put a large number of 85foot dishes in one place. Mr. ROUSH. What is the greatest distance you ever tracked a satel lite? Mr. BUCKLEY. I think it is 54 million miles. Mr. ROUSH. What is the greatest distance with which we have communicated with them? Mr. BUCKLEY. This is the same answer. Mr. ROUSH. What is the greatest distance from which you have ever transmitted photos? Mr. BUCKLEY. That is from the Moon only. We hope next July, when the vehicle gets to Mars that we will be transmitting back photos from Mars. Mr. ROUSH. What is the distance of Mars? Mr. BUCKLEY. At that time it will be 135 million miles from Earth. Mr. ROUSH. Are there other questions? Mr. MILLER. Mr. Chairman. Mr. ROUSH. Mr. Chairman. Mr. MILLER. Ten years ago the equipment you were using was not quite as sophisticated as it is today, was it? Mr. BUCKLEY. That is right. Mr. MILLER. And at that time you couldn't have anticipated some of the developments that have taken place in this field that are actually in use today, could you? Mr. BUCKLEY. No, we couldn't at all. That is right. Mr. MILLER. So aren't we dealing in a realm, a facet of science, that is continuously evolving and unfolding? Mr. BUCKLEY. That is right; yes, sir. Mr. MILLER. Of course, these are expensive pieces of equipment. Sometimes it is hard for we laymen to distinguish between them because they all look alike. I am reminded of going down to Cape Kennedy with a Presidential party, and having as my companion a very distinguished Senator, who is no longer here. As we rode along in the bus he said, "What are all those towers out there?" The lieutenant colonel who was acting as the speaker on the bus said they are different launching pads. He said, "Are all of those launching pads, and you want more money for launching pads? Haven't you any respect for the taxpayer's money?" I said, "Senator, what kind of a car did you drive 10 years ago?" "Oh, I had so and so." I said, "You could still be driving it today, "Well, yes." "But you don't, you have a new car today. You have one with air conditioning, power brakes, power steering, that you didn't have then. So aren't we in the same race here?" None of the launching pads at Kennedy at that time would have met even the minimal requirements of what we have today. I am not too certain at that particular time we anticipated the type of launch complex that we are putting into effect today, any more than we can anticipate the type of tracking centers that the next 10 years may give us in this field. I like to think that this is a part of the challenge taking place in the exploration of space. I am statisfied that we cannot see too far into the future with any of these. When we orbited that Vanguard with the grapefruit on it, we thought we had accomplished a great deal. We wouldn't even consider that today. When we exploded the first atomic bomb, the triggering devices weighed over 2,000 pounds. You can put a bomb in a 155-millimeter cannon today that is just as effective. How do you figure what progress you can take in these fields? It is a step-by-step deal. It is trial and error. We have to watch the pennies. But we cannot afford not to take chances if we are going to accomplish the ends for which we explore space. Mr. ROUSH. Last evening, Mr. Chairman, I sat at a table at the Westinghouse Science Awards dinner with a young man who happened to be from the State of California. He was one of the 40 winners. I thought I would sound him out a little bit on his attitude and ask him whether he thought we should go to the moon. He said, of course. said why? I have been asked this question, and as a politician I usually think of the practical reasons why we should go to the moon. As a young scientist he gave me the answer that we were exploring the I unknown, and that man will always explore the unknown, and that inevitably when we explore the unknown great good comes from it. That has been the history of science. Mr. MILLER. I think that is true. I want to say this. I go to these Westinghouse dinners. I wasn't there last night, but I walk around to the exhibits now, and walk in and around and get out as quickly as I can, for fear someone will ask me what these things stand for. Mr. ROUSH. They had at a table a sample of the questions which were asked apparently to qualify some of these young people. There were several scientists at my table; they were scratching their heads trying to answer the complicated questions which appeared in the questionnaire which these kids had taken. Mr. MILLER. I think this is true. High school kids are in advanced calculus. Mr. ROUSH. Are there other questions in this area? We have come at a rather appropriate place, I think, to break off here. If there is no objection, we will adjourn until tomorrow morning, and we will meet promptly at 10. I want to compliment the members for being here. We had 100-percent attendance here this morning for an extended period of time; that was very good. PREPARED STATEMENT OF EDMOND C. BUCKLEY, DIRECTOR, OFFICE of Tracking and DATA ACQUISITION, NATIONAL AERONAUTICS AND SPACE ADMINISTRATION INTRODUCTION Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee, this statement is intended to amplify and supplement the information which was presented in my statement to the full Committee on Science and Astronautics and in the fiscal year 1966 budget estimates. In particular, it relates our fiscal year 1966 budget request to program requirements and to funds authorized in past years. It is patterned after, and updates the statement that was presented to the subcommittee on February 18, 1964. An amount of $261.8 million is requested for the tracking and data acquisition program in fiscal year 1966, a decrease of $18.6 million or 7 percent from fiscal year 1965 and a decrease of $40.6 million or 15 percent from fiscal year 1964. The primary reason for the decrease is that most of the new facilities and equipment required to provide tracking and data acquisition support for the Apollo program was funded in fiscal years 1964 and 1965. The $261.8 million request is composed of $246.2 million in the "Research and development" appropriation and $15.6 million in the "Construction of facilities" appropriation. The $246.2 million "Research and development" appropriation request consists of $129.3 million for operation of the worldwide tracking and data acquisition facilities, $102.4 million for equipment and modifications to adapt the facilities for new and changing flight project requirements, and $14.5 million for supporting research and technology directed toward development of advanced tracking and data acquisition techniques and equipment for future missions. Each of the major program elements which requires funds in fiscal year 1966 will be explained in the discussion which follows. Manned space flight network OPERATIONS The fiscal year 1966 budget includes $35.1 million for operation of the manned space flight network, an increase of 45 percent from fiscal year 1965. In fiscal year 1964, an amount of $18.8 million was expended for manned space flight network operations. Although there were no manned missions during this period, the network successfully supported Centaur (AC-2), Saturn (SA-5), Ranger VI, Gemini (GT-1), Saturn (SA-6), Centaur (AC-3), and Fire I. A major part of the equipment required to convert the network from Mercury to Gemini operations was installed at the stations in fiscal year 1964. The new station at Carnarvon, Australia, became operational and required staffing |