Mr. SCOTT. I will obtain that for you, too, Senator Johnson, if you desire it. There are not any large acreages involved. Senator JOHNSON. Isn't there any very large acreage involved among your membership? Mr. SCOTT. No, sir. Senator JOHNSON. No large acreage at all? Mr. SCOTT. No; 1,300 landowners in Imperial Valley, Senator Johnson; 1,300 of them. They represent a majority of the land in Imperial County and were solicited only by mail and within 90 days. If we had made a personal solicitation we could have enhanced that materially. Senator JOHNSON. All of it was solicited in 90 days? Mr. SCOTT. Yes, sir. Senator JOHNSON. By the literature that you are going to furnish this committee? Mr. SCOTT. Yes. Senator DILL. Mr. Chairman. The CHAIRMAN. Senator Dill, of Washington. Senator DILL. Mr. Scott, I notice that in your statement the construction of the All-American Canal would not obviate the necessity of still going into Mexico to protect the Imperial Valley in the way of a levee. Mr. SCOTT. An engineer has so stated. Senator DILL. For what reason? Mr. SCOTT. The reason that I glean from it is that on account of the heavy silt that will come through the All-American Canal and the probability that storms out in the shifting sands may fill up that canal, that we better hold the present system for an emergency. And another reason is that frequently the Gila River, the confluence of which is considerably lower than the proposed dam site, floods at certain seasons, and the dam would not protect that in any way. And this engineer has made that report that we can not get along without that system. In other words, something may happen to the proposed All-American Canal if constructed that we may have to revert to the use of the present system. Senator DILL. But if the All-American Canal proves to be what is claimed for it by those who want it constructed, there would be no necessity of any further construction of levees in Mexico? Mr. SCOTT. If they satisfied Congress that that was Senator DILL. No, no; I am not talking about Congress. You say it might not work, but I say if it did work as they say it will work there would be no necessity of continuing levees in Mexico to protect Imperial Valley? Mr. SCOTT. Perhaps not, if it did work as they claim it would work. Senator DILL. You spoke also about some of this 500,000 acres in the valley not being in use and therefore the present charge was more than what would seem to be proportionate. That is, some of it is not being used. Of this 270,000 acres which your organization represents, is that all in active cultivation? Mr. ScoTT. Yes, I think it is all in cultivation. Senator DILL. And you don't know what the charge now is on that land? Mr. SCOTT. No; I have not computed it. Senator DILL. Does it run much above $30 an acre? Mr. SCOTT. Well, I have not computed it. It is just a matter of computation; I am sorry I can not answer that. Senator DILL. Well, for the 500,000, $16,000,000 would be slightly over $30 an acre? Mr. SCOTT. Yes. Senator DILL. But some of it, you say, is not in use, and I am wondering what percentage, because that raises the amount each acre has to pay materially. Mr. SCOTT. Yes; I don't know what that raise would be. think that information might be given the committee through the day. There are persons here who can give you exact figures on that subject. The CHAIRMAN. What is the water charge assessed against the lands in Mexico? Mr. SCOTT. That may be answered by persons present, Senator McNary, accurately. The CHAIRMAN. The land that is not used is mainly alkaline, due to want of drainage? Mr. SCOTT. Yes. The CHAIRMAN. Is it true that the district has recently issued bonds to take care of a rather comprehensive drainage system? Mr. SCOTT. Yes; bonds have been issued, and construction has been under way. The CHAIRMAN. Those lands now imperfectly drained will return. to use when that system is completed? Mr. SCOTT. That is our hope. Senator DILL. If the All-American Canal was constructed this present investment in the canal would be a total loss? Mr. SCOTT. That is a difference of opinion, too. I think we, under our contract would forfeit the right to that $6,000,000 investment. The CHAIRMAN. Do I understand by the construction of an AllAmerican Canal you would not abandon the present canal? Mr. SCOTT. Well, the engineers claim that that must be still maintained. But if we don't use the waters, receive any waters in American territory from Mexico under our contract, I think that we would forfeit the legal rights to use water. The CHAIRMAN. That does not answer my inquiry at all. You have a canal that cost a great many millions of dollars and you are obligated under contract with a corporation in Mexico, to bring water down the canal. If the All-American Canal were constructed, it would not displace the present canal; it would be used to irrigate new lands and supplement the water now coming from the present canal. Mr. SCOTT. Yes. The CHAIRMAN. Then the present canal, would be of the same utility then as it is now? Mr. SCOTT. Yes. Senator DILL. I do not so understand. Senator PHIPPS. I do not so understand. The CHAIRMAN. I want to understand. Mr. SCOTT. There are persons present, Senator McNary, who can answer you accurately on that. Senator JOHNSON. I think the difficulty on subjects of this sort is this gentleman is an attorney and I do not presume he is familiar with those details. Mr. SCOTT. No, I am not, Senator Johnson. The CHAIRMAN. We are trying to discover the facts; if there is anyone present who can answer that question we will have it answered by a witness who knows. Mr. SCOTT. Yes, we can have it answered; I assure the committee that. The CHAIRMAN. Senator Phipps, do you want to ask a question? Senator PHIPPS. I want to ask, how did you arrive at the figure of $40 per acre estimated additional cost on the lands now irrigated, assuming the All-American Canal is constructed? Mr. Scort. Some engineers have fixed that as the figure. Senator PHIPPS. They were given a rather low figure, but does that $40 include any amount whatever for a proportionate cost of the dam itself? Mr. SCOTT. No. Senator PHIPPS. That is merely, then, the figure that the irrigated lands in the valley would now have to burden themselves with in order to secure the All-American Canal from the intake at the river? Mr. SCOTT. Yes, sir. Senator PHIPPS. Is that correct? Mr. SCOTT. Yes, sir. Senator PHIPPS. Now, you are more or less familiar with the reclamation laws of the United States, are you not? Mr. SCOTT. Slightly; I would not claim to be an expert on those laws. Senator PHIPPS. Do you know of any reclamation that has been financed by the Government where the lands to be served with water were merely charged with the cost of the canal and not with the cost of erecting the dam, the retaining dam? Mr. SCOTT. No; I am not familiar with any projects-reclamation projects of that nature. Senator JOHNSON. So far as your estimate is concerned of $40 an acre, you know nothing of that; that is something that has been given you? Mr. SCOTT. No; that has been given by an engineer. The CHAIRMAN. Pardon me, Senator Johnson, I think that was the testimony given us at the hearings in Los Angeles, those figures. Senator JOHNSON. Yes. Mr. SCOTT. May I file with the committee the statements which I have here? The CHAIRMAN. Just give the record to the secretary you desire to insert. Senator Kendrick desires to ask you a question, Mr. Scott. Senator KENDRICK. Mr. Scott, under the terms of the agreement through which the waters of the present canal are diverted on Mexican territory and carried across that territory, as I understand it, one-half of all the water so conveyed must be delivered to the landowners of Mexico? Mr. SCOTT. That is my understanding. Senator KENDRICK. Then, in considering this question of the AllAmerican Canal, has your organization given thought to the fact that the greatest problem that confronts the seven States of the United States now who are interested in this river, is the scarcity of water for the lands in those States? Mr. SCOTT. No; we have not considered outside of our local use, on the reclamation subject. Senator KENDRICK. Then, you have not informed yourself as to the importance of preserving to the States of the United States as much of the water of this Colorado River as possible? Mr. SCOTT. We simply did not take that into our consideration, Senator Kendrick, believing that the seven States will voluntarily agree among themselves. Senator KENDRICK. Have you as an attorney considered the possibility under the terms of this contract, of being compelled to divide with Mexican land owners the additional amount of water which your organization suggests will accrue from the building of the dam? Mr. SCOTT. No; we have not considered the Mexican question; we have realized that the delay would give more water to Mexico, and for that reason we wanted the dam constructed. Senator KENDRICK. Under the terms of your contract would it not also follow that the more water impounded in these proposed reservoirs, at whatever cost, the more deeply involved the United States or private corporations or companies would become and the Mexican landowners would share in that benefit without the necessity of returning anything in the way of value for value for such ncreased supply of water? Mr. SCOTT. Well, Senator Kendrick, I don't believe that Mexico would be in a position to reject any demand that might be made upon them by the United States. I think that Mexico would be compelled to yield to United States demands in that respect and pay their share. Senator KENDRICK. Well, that is only a contingency as to whether or not they would elect to do so; they would not, under the terms of your contract as I understand it, be compelled to do so. Mr. SCOTT. That is correct; that is my understanding; they would not be compelled to. The CHAIRMAN. That is all, Mr. Scott. Mr. SCOTT. Thank you. (The membership list of the Colorado River Control Club, submitted by Mr. Scott, is in the words and figures following, to wit: J. T. Gate. C. T. Gibson (city property). E. T. Henderson. Lutz & Meyer. WITHDRAWALS | C. A. Purdy. M. R. Williams. |