Acting Chairman HERRING. Is it your opinion that your craft would object to the welders organizing as a separate craft within the A. F. L.? Mr. PETERSON. Yes; our organization has supported the position of the A. F. L. in denying to groups of welders an international charter. It is our contention that there is no need for such an organization to be established because welders in our organization are privileged to get full representation throughout the structure of our organization in the handling of any problem that may confront them in either a local lodge, a district lodge, or those coming up at conventions. I might point out to the committee that the welding problem in the railroad industry has been fairly well solved in that on most railroads welders hold membership in the shop-craft organizations, comprised of the machinists, boilermakers, blacksmiths, electrical workers, and sheet-metal workers. Welding has been pooled in a large number of railroad shops and it isn't necessary for men who follow welding exclusively to hold membership in more than one organization. I might also add that in the railroad industry a welder as a rule is a craftsman in that he has been trained either as a boilermaker, blacksmith, machinist, or sheet-metal worker. Welding is not considered a trade in the railroad industry. It is part of a trade. There is welding that is directly connected with machinists' work, welding directly connected with blacksmiths' work, boilermakers' work, electrical workers' work, and so on, so in the railroad industry we find that there isn't much of a problem as far as welding is concerned. We have solved it in my opinion in a manner that would lead me to believe that the same solution could possibly be applied in other industries. I think maybe I should make a statement about welding processes, although I don't claim to qualify as an expert on welding. We know that employers are specializing even when it comes to welding. We know that there are operators in mass-production industries who do spot welding and flash welding, where they operate huge machines that weld bodies, automobile bodies, at one throw of an electric switch. We know that there is welding in the jewelry industry where girls use the acetylene torch in welding processes on jewelry. We know that in contract shops welders are also qualified craftsmen. They are capable of doing machinists' work when it comes to operating machine tools or erecting machinery or assembling machinery, and also welding. We know that in some industries they have men who use nothing but the electric-arc process. They are not familiar with acetylene welding and possibly could not qualify when it comes to welding alloys. We know there are men that specialize in what we call highpressure welding, welding of tanks and containers that have to withstand pressures running up as high as 3,000 pounds to the square inch. We know there are men who are confined to just building up processes, where they build up worn parts. In other words, employers have specialized even in the welding field until we find that there are a very limited number of welders who can be said to be general all-around welders, men who can qualify where they have to pass examinations and do what is called X-ray work, so, in our opinion, the welding problem isn't as complicated as it has been presented here, and doesn't constitute a problem that should continue to interrupt work in the defense industries. I gathered the impression here that representatives of the welders were more concerned in establishing an independent organization than they were in improving conditions and establishing better wage rates for those who follow the welding work. In that connection I might point out that in the railroad industry, again using that as an example, we have established a differential for men who do welding. That differential is 5 cents an hour over the rate set for journeymen of various crafts. A man may weld for 1 hour during the day or 2 or 3 hours or more, and he gets 5 cents an hour above the rate for journeymen in the various crafts while he is on that work. If he is employed continually on welding, of course, he gets that differential all of the time that he is performing that work, so again I say that so far as the International Association of Machinists is concerned, we believe that the welding problem is one that has been very much exaggerated, one that has been solved fairly satisfactorily in the railroad industry, and we believe that if the men who are interested in keeping defense production going will sit down with representatives of the organizations that they have held membership in or may be members of yet, that this problem can be worked out. Acting Chairman HERRING. I think it has been correctly stated that the interest of this committee is in the defense program and as you know, by experience in welding, there have been great advances made just recently and in the defense program. I think even as late as yesterday it was called to the attention of the press in New York by Mr. Knudsen of the advantages that could be gained by use of spot welding and other types of welding in the defense program, and I assume that is the interest of this committee. Mr. PETERSON. I think that is generally recognized by all of the organizations comprising the metal trades department of the A. F. L. I don't presume to know what the figures are but I would say that at the present time the boilermakers organization represents a larger number of welders in the ship building industry than any other organization, and I assume that the committee has asked a representative of that organization to be here to present to the committee his views on this problem that has been called to your attention by the welders' group. Mr. FULTON. We offer an opportunity but fundamentally the committee's big interest was in this question as to whether there is a possibility of a strike which might tie up all the shipbuilding and other similar defense industries by reason of say the walk-out or lock out, whichever it might be, of some large proportion of the welders. That would of course react against the machinists themselves because they wouldn't probably be able to work in some of the shipyards if there were not enough welders to keep the yards going, so you have the same interests that the committee has. Do you feel such a strike is imminent or possible, or what reaction have you? Mr. PETERSON. I understand that threats have been made by representatives of the welders that another strike is imminent unless the O. P. M. can bring about an understanding that suits their desires. Mr. FULTON. That is why it is important. There is some half-way place where the two could meet and the committee's only interest is not in trying to forward the interest of either side but in trying to see that both sides for their own benefit try to get a middle ground solution or solution that they can work out between themselves so that the shipyards wouldn't be shut down by such a strike. any Mr. PETERSON. I presume the committee is familiar with the fact that hearings are now being held on the Pacific coast in the various shipbuilding centers by representatives of the O. P. M. and to these hearings have been invited representatives of the welders' groups and also representatives of the employers and international unions, interested in the shipbuilding industry. Mr. FULTON. And do you believe that some solution can be found there? Mr. PETERSON. I think some solution can be worked out. Acting Chairman HERRING. Thank you, unless you have something else to offer. Mr. PETERSON. I would like to leave a copy of the statement that was recently released by the metal trades unions.1 Acting Chairman HERRING. That may be placed in the record. Is there any other representative here that desires to be heard? If not the committee will adjourn until 10:30 tomorrow morning. (Whereupon at 12:15 o'clock a recess was taken until 10:30 a. m., December 5, 1941.) 1 Previously entered as Exhibit No. 323, see appendix, p. 4158. INVESTIGATION OF NATIONAL DEFENSE PROGRAM FRIDAY, DECEMBER 5, 1941 UNITED STATES SENATE, SPECIAL COMMITTEE TO INVESTIGATE Washington, D. C. The committee met at 10:38 a. m., pursuant to adjournment on Thursday, December 4, 1941, in room 318, Senate Office Building, Senator James M. Mead, presiding. Present: Senators James M. Mead (acting chairman), Styles Bridges, and Clyde L. Herring. Present also: Mr. Hugh A. Fulton, chief counsel; Mr. Charles P. Clark, associate chief counsel. Acting Chairman MEAD. General Osborn, will you be sworn? Do you solemnly swear that you will tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God? General OSBORN. I do. STATEMENT OF ACTING CHAIRMAN JAMES M. MEAD ARMY RECREATION FACILITIES Acting Chairman MEAD. This particular session has been authorized by the chairman for the purpose of looking into the recreational facilities available for the boys at the various camps. During our survey last August and September, we had opportunity to look at the facilities available in some of the camps and sites and to talk to the officers and men about the facilities, the presence of them and the lack of them. We learned that it was more or less at that time left to the judgment of the commanding officer, and in one case we learned that the commanding officer was willing to take chances and perhaps invite discipline by becoming an extremist in advocating athletic games and competition and recreational facilities that would buoy up the morale and make the boys physically fit and cause them to like their jobs a little better. In other places we were told by the commanding officer that they were interested in other things, and we took it for granted that he wasn't an advocate of football or baseball and probably never enjoyed the games anyway. Anyway, I want to put in the record an analysis showing the strength of the prospective posts and the facilities of each of the following posts, which I think reveals ridiculous situations: Camp Stewart with a strength of 17,000 men has 2 basketball courts and no gymnasium, no swimming pool, no football field, no handball 311932-42-pt. 10—3 3755 |