Department and I have said that I would certainly be in favor of an amendment to have an Assistant Secretary specifically designated to be in charge of FHA, who also would be appointed by the President. The language of the bill would spell out that one Assistant Secretary would definitely be designated to perform the function of FHA. Why doesn't that give you what you want?

Mr. CAMERON. Well, this is the way the Department operates presently and it seems to have brought up no problem at all.

Senator RIBICOFF. But it is not now a Department. This is the problem. What I am curious about is this: Are you just concerned with preserving the status of FHA to make sure that FHA stays with its basic functions, or are you against the entire concept of having a Department concerned with the many problems of our urban society? Mr. CAMERON. Our primary interest is seeing that the FHA sticks to its original plan.

Senator RIBICOFF. In other words, if in the language of the bill this assurance remains, then your organization has no basic objection to having a Department concerned with the problems of urban affairs as long as you preserve the basic function of FHA.

Mr. CAMERON. Well our association has never taken a specific stand on this. I would hate to say to you here today "Yes" or "No." Several years ago our association, back in I believe it was 1961, said that we would not object to the Department of Housing and Urban Affairs, as I recall at that time, as long as the FHA did maintain its identity and would operate as an entity performing the initial functions. I can't tell you exactly how our association would feel today on this since we did not establish policy on it.

Senator RIBICOFF. Some groups who opposed the Department in 1961 now favor it. Do you think that your organization having been in favor of it in 1961 would retrogress and now be against it?

Mr. CAMERON. It is possible. But I think that with an amendment as we suggested our association would be in favor of it.

Senator RIBICOFF. Thank you very much, Mr. Cameron. Our next witness is Mr. Robert L. Williams.

STATEMENT OF ROBERT L. WILLIAMS, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, AMERICAN INSTITUTE OF PLANNERS; ACCOMPANIED BY DAVID K. HARTLEY, DIRECTOR OF INSTITUTE DEVELOPMENT

Mr. WILLIAMS. Mr. Chairman, my name is Robert L. Williams. I am executive director for the American Institute of Planners. I am accompanied here today by Mr. David K. Hartley, director of our institute development.

Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee, the American Institute of Planners welcomes this opportunity to express its wholehearted support of S. 1599, a bill to establish a new Department of Housing and Urban Development. The institute is the professional society of city and regional planners in the United States. Its 3,900 members account for the professional planning staffs in city, metropolitan and State planning agencies, and in many housing and urban renewal agencies. Other members of the institute, in private practice, serve as consultants to local, State and Federal agencies on problems of urban growth. Thus, the profession is well qualified by experience and interest to testify on matters concerning urban development and the Federal responsibility.

As President Johnson stated in his March 2, 1965, message on housing and urban development, over 70 percent of our population—135 million Americans-live in urban areas now; by the year 2000 some 320 million of the estimated 400 million Americans will be urban dwellers, or 4 of every 5.

A great proportion of this population growth will occur within or on the expanding perimeters of our present metropolitan centers. To accommodate this new population our present land area devoted to urban uses will be doubled by the year 2000. We are in an era of accelerated urban development that will shape the American way of life and our environment for generations. Thus, the need for coordinated, comprehensive national policies and programs directed toward urban growth problems becomes immediately obvious.

The proper coordination of national goals with those of local, metropolitan, and State governments is required if current Federal aid programs to urban areas are to be efficiently and effectively administered. This means that at the national level authority must be combined with creativity. A mere service or informational unit approach will not suffice. A service unit cannot provide the essential long-range thinking or the measurement of the social, economic, and physical implications of accelerated urban growth. The proposed Department of Housing and Urban Development, however, can provide a clear, focused voice at the Cabinet table on urban trends and needs. Without such a voice it is quite possible that national program formulation will not reflect national goals. The old saying "out of sight, out of mind” can apply also to top-level Government.

No single department of the Federal Government will ever embrace all Federal aids to urban areas, and no single department can ever coordinate other departments. On the other hand, the initiation of governmentwide policies is unlikely until a Department of Housing and Urban Development is established. The proper coordination of Federal programs is also unlikely until State and local governments have a recognized Cabinet official charged with responsibility for representing them in the executive branch. The establishment of a Department of Housing and Urban Development, if accompanied by appropriate means for stimulating local and metropolitan planning and decisionmaking and a recognition that Federal aids should serve locally established objectives, will serve to strengthen rather than weaken our system of local government.

The American Institute of Planners has devoted considerable study to creation of a Cabinet-level Department of Housing and Urban Development. An official planning-policy committee was established in 1960, and a report recommending the Department was studied by the entire membership. After reviewing comments made by members, the institute's governing body, the board of governors, adopted an official statement supporting this legislation in October 1963. Thus, there is clear support for this new Department on the part of the planning profession-the group that is probably as much involved in creating a better urban environment as any.

INSTITUTE OF URBAN DEVELOPMENT

We would like to add a further suggestion. President Johnson's message on housing and urban development of March 2, 1965, very eloquently defines the role the new department will play in the Great Society. As part of this role, he stated the intention to establish an

Institute of Urban Development in the new Department. We emphatically support creation of this institute as vital to the new Department's program. Similarly, we specifically urge the new Department to implement the President's suggestion for a Temporary National Commission on Codes, Zoning, Taxation, and Development Standards. The new Department should proceed quickly with the establishment of a nationwide program of research on urban development, land economics, government, and planning and development techniques. At the same time the Department should establish a broad program of technical assistance and urban extension activities to provide assistance and information to State and local governments, citizen organizations, and other groups on urban problems and the methods available for their solution. Only a program on the scale of the research and extension programs of the Agriculture Department or of the National Institutes of Health can provide assurance that our national resources of research and professional leadership are being utilized to the full for the solution of problems of urban development. We have appreciated this opportunity of presenting our views on this important subject. As President Johnson stated:

The modern city can be the most ruthless enemy of the good life, or it can be its servant. The choice is up to this generation of Americans. For this is truly the time of decision for the American city.

Professional planners, laboring in the midst of urbanization, are convinced that a Department of Housing and Urban Development is a step in the right direction.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Senator RIBICOFF. Thank you very much for your very strong statement, Mr. Williams. There are very few people who are more aware of the basic problems we have in our cities than the men and women who make up your organization. The burdens of planning for and advising city, State and private agencies fall on your shoulders. We are very pleased to have the support of your important organization. Our next witness is Mr. Kenneth A. Meiklejohn of the AFL-CIO. STATEMENT OF ANDREW J. BIEMILLER, DIRECTOR, DEPARTMENT OF LEGISLATION, AMERICAN FEDERATION OF LABOR AND CONGRESS OF INDUSTRIAL ORGANIZATIONS, PRESENTED BY KENNETH A. MEIKLEJOHN, LEGISLATIVE REPRESENTATIVE

Mr. MEIKLEJOHN. Mr. Chairman, I am Kenneth A. Meiklejohn, legislative representative of the American Federation of Labor and Congress of Industrial Organizations. I appear here this morning for Andrew J. Biemiller who has asked me to come to read his statement to the committee in his place. He is unavoidably absent and unable to come, but did ask me to come and read this statement for him. I will read it as it is so that you will have a full text.

[Reading:] Mr. Chairman, my name is Andrew J. Biemiller. I am director of legislation for the American Federation of Labor and Congress of Industrial Organizations, and I am here today to express our support for S. 1599, a bill to establish in the executive branch of the Federal Government a Department of Housing and Urban Development, with full Cabinet status.

This bipartisan proposal to set up a Department of Housing and Urban Development is one that the AFL-CIO has strongly supported since merger of the federation in 1955.

And at our most recent constitutional convention in 1963, the AFLCIO declared:

We reaffirm our support for the establishment of a Cabinet-level Federal Department of Housing and Urban Development. It should be the task of this Department to coordinate and provide leadership in all national housing and community development programs, and formulate for submission to the Congress and for implementation by all Federal agencies of a coherent set of Federal housing, renewal, and urban development programs.

The establishment of the Department of Housing and Urban Development would provide for economy, for more efficient administration, and good Government. It would facilitate representation of local community interests and would make possible fuller acceptance of local initiative through representations by local authorities before one coordinated agency of the Federal Government.

Today 70 percent of the population of the United States lives in urban areas, as I think the committee will know by the time this hearing is over. By the year 2000, only 35 years from now, the Nation's population will have increased by 150 million persons-from 190 million to about 340 million. But of this increase at least 80 percent will occur in urban and urbanizing areas, adding another 120 million to the present urban population of 133 million.

A scattered array of Federal agencies simply cannot deal effectively with this staggering growth of urban areas and massive population shift in our land. In the interest of efficiency, economy and just plain good Government, a unified, coherent structure is needed to coordinate administration of the Nation's Federal housing and urban development programs.

Enactment of legislation along the lines of S. 1599 will make possible such a unified, coherent structure. Creation of the proposed Department will give recognition to the vital importance of these housing and urban development programs which contribute so much to the Nation's economy and to the welfare of its people.

Furthermore, such a Cabinet-level Department will enable the President to give more assistance, coordination, and direction to the many complex Federal programs relating to housing and urban development. This Department will be a focal point within the Federal Government to guide and to help State, county, and municipal governments, and private enterprise in their efforts to accomplish and to develop the Nation's housing and urban development programs in the local communities.

Therefore, Mr. Chairman, we strongly support this bill, S. 1599, which sets up a Cabinet-level Department of Housing and Urban Development to coordinate and to provide leadership for the Nation's housing and community development programs.

May I say in conclusion, Mr. Chairman, we appreciate this opportunity to appear.

Senator RIBICOFF. Thank you very much, Mr. Meiklejohn, for giving us the views of organized labor. We are very pleased to have your support.

At this point in the record we will insert the testimony of the Chamber of Commerce of the United States of America.

(The testimony referred to is as follows:)

EXHIBIT 23

TESTIMONY BY JAMES F. STEINER

FOR THE

CHAMBER OF COMMERCE OF THE UNITED STATES

My name is James F. Steiner. I am Manager of the Construction and Community Development Department of the Chamber of Commerce of the United States. With me is Harvey G. Hallenbeck, Jr., assistant manager

of the department.

We appear on behalf of the Chamber of Commerce of the United States to present its recommendations on S. 1599, The "Department of Housing and Urban Development Act."

The National Chamber vigorously supports local responsibility and action for community development and opposes the view that the federal government should bear increased responsibility for the sound development of local communities.

The National Chamber opposes S. 1599 because:

1. The substantive provisions of the bill are at variance with its expressed aims.

2. The bill furthers the obsolescent design of the 1930's for a larger federal government image in the conduct of local affairs taking a course opposed to the growing, strong thrust toward new local solutions of community problems.

Before discussing these reasons further, it is worthwhile to

summarize, briefly, the contents of the bill.

Following the short title of the bill, there is (in section 2)

the proposed declaration of purpose and a statement of four aims. The se aims, in brief, are: