wisely. I would hope all of them are, but there are some good examples of the innovations that they are engaging in in an effort to improve our education curriculum. Mrs. DWYER. Would you send this to my office? Dr. ESTES. Would be delighted to send this and some other things, if you'd like. Mr. FOUNTAIN. We will give you a chance to propagandize. Mr. HEARN. This is on the use of computers. That is a very complex subject and it's about the attempt to get at what is happening in the schools. Mr. FOUNTAIN. Any other questions? Mrs. DWYER. No questions. Mr. FOUNTAIN. The committee thanks you again. The committee stands recessed subject to the call of the Chair. (Whereupon, at 1:20 p.m., the subcommittee recessed subject to the call of the Chair.) OPERATIONS OF THE OFFICE OF EDUCATION THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 14, 1967 HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, INTERGOVERNMENTAL RELATIONS SUBCOMMITTEE, The subcommittee met at 10 a.m. in room 2203, Rayburn House Office Building, the Honorable L. H. Fountain, chairman of the subcommittee, presiding. Present Representatives L. H. Fountain, John A. Blatnik, J. Edward Roush, Benjamin S. Rosenthal, Florence P. Dwyer, and Robert Dole. Staff members present: James Naughton, subcommittee counsel; and Thomas Smith, minority staff counsel. Mr. FOUNTAIN. Let the committee come to order, and the record show that a quorum is present, consisting of Mr. Roush, Mr. Rosenthal, Mr. Dole, and the chairman. I understand that other members of the committee will soon be in. Under the rules of the House of Representatives, the Committee on Government Operations has responsibility for studying the operation of Government activities at all levels with respect to economy and efficiency. That responsibility insofar as it relates to the Department of Health, Education, and Welfare and certain other departments and agencies has been delegated by the full committee to its Intergovernmental Relations Subcommittee. The subcommittee hearings today and tomorrow are a continuation of its hearings on the manner in which the Office of Education is administering grant programs. A prior hearing on this subject was held on June 29. As I pointed out at our earlier hearing, funds being spent by the Office of Education for grants to State and local agencies, to educational institutions and in some cases to other organizations, have increased tremendously. Our hearings today and tomorrow will be concerned primarily with conflict of interest questions involving operations of the Office of Education. I would like to say that our purpose will be to get the true facts insofar as possible in connection with specific grant situations. The Chair, and, so far as I know, members of the committee, have no preconceived notions. Our purpose is to get the true facts about the situation, for the benefit of the agency as well as the Congress. Because of the nature of the subject matter we are considering, I think it might be appropriate to take sworn testimony. Therefore, I am going to ask each of our witnesses to give his name and position for the record, after which I will ask you to be sworn. We have with us this morning Dr. Nolan Estes, Associate Commissioner for Elementary and Secondary Education, U.S. Office of Education; Dr. R. Louis Bright, Associate Commissioner for Research, U.S. Office of Education; Mr. O. Ray Warner, Division of Plans and Supplementary Centers, Bureau of Elementary and Secondary Education; Mr. William H. Hinze, Division of Plans and Supplementary Centers, Bureau of Elementary and Secondary Education; and Mr. Albert L. Alford, Assistant Commissioner for Legislation, U.S. Office of Education. Dr. Bright, will you raise your right hand? Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God? Dr. BRIGHT. I do. TESTIMONY OF DR. R. LOUIS BRIGHT, ASSOCIATE COMMISSIONER FOR RESEARCH, U.S. OFFICE OF EDUCATION Mr. FOUNTAIN. The record will show that Dr. Bright has been sworn. I have a hard time keeping misters and doctors, and the variety of doctors, straight. I believe it is Dr. Bright and Dr. Estes. I may call you either doctor or mister. Dr. ESTES. That is all right. Mr. FOUNTAIN. Will you please give us a brief description of your responsibilities at the Office of Education? Dr. BRIGHT. I am the Director of the Bureau of Research in the Office of Education, which is responsible for the administration of all the research titles of the various education acts. My responsibility is the full range of the administration of these acts and the staffing of the Bureau and all the other responsibilities associated with it. Mr. FOUNTAIN. For the record, what was your last position prior to joining the Office of Education? Dr. BRIGHT. I was the associate director of research for Westinghouse Electric. Mr. FOUNTAIN. What were your primary responsibilities in that position? Dr. BRIGHT. I was responsible for all of the systems engineering and new products, including everything from semiconductor materials to dishwashers to underseas instrumentation to educational studies-a full range of Westinghouse products. Mr. FOUNTAIN. At this point, for the benefit of the other members of the committee, let me say that in my own questions, if some response should prompt you to want to ask a question in connection with that question, don't hesitate to seek recognition. We want to get the full picture. When did you join the Office of Education? Dr. BRIGHT. I joined the Office in January 1966. Mr. FOUNTAIN. What were the circumstances which led you to change jobs? Dr. BRIGHT. The effective persuasion of Mr. Keppel. Mr. FOUNTAIN. Had you previously been associated or acquainted with Mr. Keppel? Dr. BRIGHT. I would say only for a period of perhaps 6 or 9 months, as onsequence of my involvement in the educational line. Mr. FOUNTAIN. What were the circumstances under which he contacted you about coming into the department, and when? Dr. BRIGHT. It was Henry Loomis that originally contacted me, and then I had conversations with Mr. Loomis and Frank Keppel. It must have been in September 1965 or thereabouts. Mr. FOUNTAIN. How did the offer come about? What were the circumstances? Were you visiting here, or he visiting Westinghouse? Dr. BRIGHT. I really don't remember for sure. I had several conversations with him about computerized classrooms and this kind of thing. Mr. FOUNTAIN. Was that the subject matter which brought you together? Dr. BRIGHT. This was the subject matter that brought us together, yes. Mr. FOUNTAIN. Would you identify Henry Loomis? Dr. BRIGHT. He was the Deputy Commissioner of Education at that time. Mr. FOUNTAIN. I think it might be of interest to the members and for the record, too, if you would, Doctor, give us your educational background, education and experience. Dr. BRIGHT. I did my undergraduate work at Carnegie Tech in mathematics. I then switched departments and got my Ph. D. in electrical engineering in 1950. I had been a member of the graduate faculty at Carnegie Tech and I taught for 7 academic years at Carnegie Tech in mathematics and electrical engineering. I was primarily interested in education and decided it didn't make sense to teach engineering without industrial experience, so I went into industry with Westinghouse with the intention of staying about 5 years and going back into education. I was there for 12. During that time I worked on a very large variety of things, primarily relating to semiconductors and computers. However, the last couple of years was very heavily spent in psychology. I got very much interested in the educational development, particularly in student motivation. I initiated and supported, I think, the largest programs that had been done anywhere in studies of student motivation and related basic behavioral psychology. Mr. FOUNTAIN. It sounds complicated, but also extremely interesting. Mr. Naughton? Mr. NAUGHTON. Dr. Bright, you indicated that you knew Mr. Keppel over a period of 6 to 9 months. Was that in connection with some governmental work or what was the occasion that brought you together? Dr. BRIGHT. It wasn't in connection with any governmental work. We had no program or project in the Office of Education. We met casually at a meeting. I remarked that I would like to have an opportunity to chat with him about computer aid to instruction. He then invited me to his office. This must have been back in, I would guess, something of the order of the first quarter of 1965. I spent about 3 hours in his office one day discussing this whole area and that was the initial introduction. Mr. FOUNTAIN. At the time you left Westinghouse was there any discussion of or arrangement for your returning to Westinghouse at some future date? Dr. BRIGHT. There was not and there is not. Mr. FOUNTAIN. Have you been in any discussions since that time? Dr. BRIGHT. No, sir. I would guess there is at most a 50-50 chance. Mr. FOUNTAIN. Approximately how much money is spent annually for grants under programs administered by the Bureau of Research? Dr. BRIGHT. Approximately $90 million a year. Mr. FOUNTAIN. I wonder if you would submit for the record-you may have it here, I doubt it-a more detailed breakdown, showing the amount of grant funds spent under each such program administered by your office? Dr. BRIGHT. Certainly. I could give it now if you wish. Mr. FOUNTAIN. All right, you can give it now. Dr. BRIGHT. About $10 million under the Vocational Education Act, $4.4 million under title VII of NDEA, $3 million under title VI of NDEA, approximately $60 million under title IV of ESEA, $3.5 million under title II of the Higher Education Act, a half million dollars under the foreign exchange, one of the agricultural acts. (The following additional material was submitted for the record :) Bureau of Research obligations by program, fiscal year 1967 Program General education__ Research and development centers_. Educational laboratories (exclusive of construction) Vocational education__‒‒‒ Foreign language development (research) Educational media___ Library improvement_ Research training-. Dissemination Equipment (R. & D. centers and educational laboratories) __ Amount $21, 184, 000 9,930,000 17, 712,000 9, 793,000 2,793, 000 4,371, 000 3,381,000 5,916, 000 2,518, 000 300,000 Subtotal_ 77, 898,000 Construction (no-year funds, authorized but not obligated) – 12, 100, 000 Grand total__ 89, 998, 000 BRIEF DESCRIPTION OF PROGRAMS 1. General education.-This is the general research program, providing support for approved projects submitted in (unsolicited) applications from colleges and universities, State departments of education, local school districts, professional organizations with research interests and competence, etc. 2. Research and development centers. Each center conducts programatic research within a focused area, such as curriculum development for disadvantaged children, school-community relations and support, individualization of instruction, etc. 3. Educational laboratories.-These are devoted mainly to promoting and assisting the application of research findings in the educational system, with emphasis on the public schools, and (as yet) only limited emphasis on higher education. Each laboratory is oriented to the special needs of its own region. 4. Vocational education.-Research is conducted on the improvement of curriculum, methods, organization, administration, etc., of vocational education. Close liaison is maintained with State departments of education, as well as local school systems. 5. Foreign language research.-Studies and surveys are supported "to determine the need for increased or improved instruction in modern foreign languages ** to conduct research on more effective methods of teaching such languages and to develop specialized materials for use in such training." ** 6. Educational media. This program supports research on, and the dissemination of information about, new educational media-such as television, radio, |